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A slight variation on Stuarts puzzle: spot the similarities between these two supposedly different vehicles - you will need to follow the links to the websites where there are plenty of pictures on both to help you compare and contrast. FYI the original AHY 990B 970S was built mid October 1964.

https://www.handh.co.uk/auction/lot/346 ... ?lot=49920



and

https://themarket.co.uk/listings/austin ... 1&slide=67



The nice EBW 177B sold for £20k and shortly afterwards the registration number turned up for sale on ebay 12/2019 as a project car with blasted non Cooper bodyshell.

Estimated price for the 970 S is £35000+.

Front bumper's the same!!!!!!!!!!

surfblue63 wrote: ↑Thu May 21, 2020 7:24 pm Front bumper's the same!!!!!!!!!!

Doesn't end there does it!! Ooooooeeer missus!!!!

Does it not have an earlier "flat floor"?

How mysterious. And still in Oxfordshire! You're probably aware Simon that the EBW registration would have been an Oxfordshire "age related" replacement at some previous time.

Amazing how the underfloor on both cars is exactly the same red and black, and the marks and rust of the subframes is exactly the same...

I'm laughing that "The Market" state that the Mini was resprayed in the "correct shade" of Tartan Red whilst displaying a Heritage certificate telling us that the car should be Almond Green.
And if the car has flat floor incorporation the sills, why is there an invoice showing new inner and outer sills having been fitted
Given the white roof when sold by "The Market" it's surprising that the car didn't become an "Ex Works Car" - or have they all been "done" now?
At least it now has a black roof but this does demonstrate how difficult it can be to find a genuine car.
I'm thinking that an October 1964 car should have the later cant rail and crushable sunvisors? Hydrolastic too?
Oh dear

Ha, ha, well spotted Simon!

Would be interesting to put those vehicles side by side.

Ah, Hipwell, you obviously subscribe to the parallel universe theory.

Thing is, if this information gets to the certain people it will get crushed!!!!!!!!!!!

Indeed.

What ever happened to that cartoon ringing bell gif...?

I see that a sex change (from Austin to Morris) has taken place. It would be interesting to look inside the bonnet and bootlids wouldn't it and see if the signs of previous holes are present.
The current 970 car has not been taxed since 1988(!) and surprise surprise the latest V5 was issued a year or so ago.
I couldn't see the chassis plate in the photos to see if that looked old or new.
I thought the bootlid looked a bit "Heritage" doesn't it? On "both" cars.

I do recall the Cooper 'project' on ebay with the blasted shell. The shell only had been on ebay a few weeks previously, from the South West I think.

It is commendable to see knowledgeable enthusiasts flagging up cloned rare model cars which are on the market trying to deceive people. I support this action but honestly believe the DVLA don’t give a cobblers. When you see blatant fakes paraded as the real original cars in reality the owners have a barefaced cheek claiming their obvious fakes are the real deal.

Only recently if you recall the Princess Margaret Mini Cooper S registration mark 999 FYL was claimed to be restored. That car had not been restored because the car originally belonging to Princess Margaret didn’t exist to be restored. Everybody knows that and who cares seems the outcome.

Much of the blame for re-issuing registration numbers on little or very dubious evidence must be laid at the door of the DVLA. Does anyone believe for one moment that the DVLA cares a jot?

I don’t

Alan

I noticed the mileage of both is comparable. So, is the 'new' reg applied to the old car, including the changes (make, roof color, seat belts, air filter, gauges etc.) to be able to sell for more, and use the 'old' reg to sell a non Cooper shell for Cooper money??

Who pays £35k for a badly presented (dusty) & rusty car with dubious history? I wouldn't...

A 970S had a value in 1988 - I wouldn't be surprised if the original was exported and the V5 retained.

I'm assuming the '970S' still has the 1071S engine? As the engine is a large part of the rarity value of a 970S, I wonder how many buyers ever check the actual cc before or after buying?

So who's going to email the auctioneers?

I don't have a problem with logbook rebuilds if you're actually creating something, but this is blatant ringing.

As the shell used is an early one it will probably still its original chassis number stamped on the bulkhead angled brace.


Costafortune.... I agree with you ........You can bring this point up with the Auction when you email them .

There is of course the possibility that whoever purchased the car on its EBW 177B age-related plate did the research on the chassis number, found that the original reg would have been AHY 990B, then went the V765 route via DVLA to reclaim the original plate. But that wouldn’t explain how EBW 177B could then be sold on with another shell...