Spot the similarities

General Chat with an emphasis on BMC Minis & Other iconic cars of the 1960's.
User avatar
Simon776
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 1181
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 6:08 pm
Location: Shakspere's county

Spot the similarities

Post by Simon776 »

A slight variation on Stuarts puzzle: spot the similarities between these two supposedly different vehicles - you will need to follow the links to the websites where there are plenty of pictures on both to help you compare and contrast. FYI the original AHY 990B 970S was built mid October 1964.

https://www.handh.co.uk/auction/lot/346 ... ?lot=49920

Image

and

https://themarket.co.uk/listings/austin ... 1&slide=67

Image

The nice EBW 177B sold for £20k and shortly afterwards the registration number turned up for sale on ebay 12/2019 as a project car with blasted non Cooper bodyshell.

Estimated price for the 970 S is £35000+.
The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who do not possess it.
surfblue63

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by surfblue63 »

Front bumper's the same!!!!!!!!!!
AndyPen
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 3903
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 5:55 pm
Location: South Wales
Has thanked: 16 times
Been thanked: 45 times

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by AndyPen »

surfblue63 wrote: Thu May 21, 2020 7:24 pm Front bumper's the same!!!!!!!!!!

Doesn't end there does it!! Ooooooeeer missus!!!!
Old English White
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 2631
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 5:07 pm
Location: Southern England
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by Old English White »

Does it not have an earlier "flat floor"?

How mysterious. And still in Oxfordshire! You're probably aware Simon that the EBW registration would have been an Oxfordshire "age related" replacement at some previous time.
coopersean
850 Super
Posts: 176
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2011 9:41 pm
Location: Derbyshire

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by coopersean »

Amazing how the underfloor on both cars is exactly the same red and black, and the marks and rust of the subframes is exactly the same...
car2.jpg
car1.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Old English White
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 2631
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 5:07 pm
Location: Southern England
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by Old English White »

I'm laughing that "The Market" state that the Mini was resprayed in the "correct shade" of Tartan Red whilst displaying a Heritage certificate telling us that the car should be Almond Green.
And if the car has flat floor incorporation the sills, why is there an invoice showing new inner and outer sills having been fitted :(
Given the white roof when sold by "The Market" it's surprising that the car didn't become an "Ex Works Car" - or have they all been "done" now?
At least it now has a black roof but this does demonstrate how difficult it can be to find a genuine car.
I'm thinking that an October 1964 car should have the later cant rail and crushable sunvisors? Hydrolastic too?
Oh dear :?
mk1
Site Admin
Posts: 19846
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 11:30 am
Location: Away with the Faries
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 8 times

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by mk1 »

Ha, ha, well spotted Simon!
User avatar
Hipwell
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 1374
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2015 3:02 pm
Location: Solihull, UK
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by Hipwell »

Would be interesting to put those vehicles side by side. :lol:
mk1
Site Admin
Posts: 19846
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 11:30 am
Location: Away with the Faries
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 8 times

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by mk1 »

Ah, Hipwell, you obviously subscribe to the parallel universe theory.
surfblue63

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by surfblue63 »

Thing is, if this information gets to the certain people it will get crushed!!!!!!!!!!! :o
66Traveller
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 1354
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2012 4:47 pm
Location: Belgium

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by 66Traveller »

Indeed.

What ever happened to that cartoon ringing bell gif...?
Old English White
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 2631
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 5:07 pm
Location: Southern England
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by Old English White »

I see that a sex change (from Austin to Morris) has taken place. It would be interesting to look inside the bonnet and bootlids wouldn't it and see if the signs of previous holes are present.
The current 970 car has not been taxed since 1988(!) and surprise surprise the latest V5 was issued a year or so ago.
I couldn't see the chassis plate in the photos to see if that looked old or new.
I thought the bootlid looked a bit "Heritage" doesn't it? On "both" cars.
steve1071
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 2180
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 7:34 pm
Location: Leeds
Has thanked: 9 times
Been thanked: 13 times

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by steve1071 »

I do recall the Cooper 'project' on ebay with the blasted shell. The shell only had been on ebay a few weeks previously, from the South West I think.

:x
Supersonic
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 2054
Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2015 4:25 pm
Location: Crossgar County Down Northern Ireland

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by Supersonic »

It is commendable to see knowledgeable enthusiasts flagging up cloned rare model cars which are on the market trying to deceive people. I support this action but honestly believe the DVLA don’t give a cobblers. When you see blatant fakes paraded as the real original cars in reality the owners have a barefaced cheek claiming their obvious fakes are the real deal.

Only recently if you recall the Princess Margaret Mini Cooper S registration mark 999 FYL was claimed to be restored. That car had not been restored because the car originally belonging to Princess Margaret didn’t exist to be restored. Everybody knows that and who cares seems the outcome.

Much of the blame for re-issuing registration numbers on little or very dubious evidence must be laid at the door of the DVLA. Does anyone believe for one moment that the DVLA cares a jot?

I don’t :(

Alan
User avatar
CMC
850 Super
Posts: 112
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 11:18 am
Location: The Netherlands

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by CMC »

I noticed the mileage of both is comparable. So, is the 'new' reg applied to the old car, including the changes (make, roof color, seat belts, air filter, gauges etc.) to be able to sell for more, and use the 'old' reg to sell a non Cooper shell for Cooper money??

Who pays £35k for a badly presented (dusty) & rusty car with dubious history? I wouldn't...
User avatar
Costafortune
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 2064
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2017 9:26 am
Location: Sheffield On Thames
Has thanked: 23 times
Been thanked: 29 times

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by Costafortune »

A 970S had a value in 1988 - I wouldn't be surprised if the original was exported and the V5 retained.
User avatar
mab01uk
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 8442
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 7:08 pm
Location: S.E. England
Has thanked: 191 times
Been thanked: 147 times

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by mab01uk »

I'm assuming the '970S' still has the 1071S engine? As the engine is a large part of the rarity value of a 970S, I wonder how many buyers ever check the actual cc before or after buying?
User avatar
Costafortune
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 2064
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2017 9:26 am
Location: Sheffield On Thames
Has thanked: 23 times
Been thanked: 29 times

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by Costafortune »

So who's going to email the auctioneers? ;) :lol:

I don't have a problem with logbook rebuilds if you're actually creating something, but this is blatant ringing.
User avatar
IAIN
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 1090
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 3:40 pm
Location: Scotland

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by IAIN »

As the shell used is an early one it will probably still its original chassis number stamped on the bulkhead angled brace.


Costafortune.... I agree with you ........You can bring this point up with the Auction when you email them . ;) :D
User avatar
iain1967s
1275 Cooper S
Posts: 1844
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2017 12:46 am
Location: Cambridge, MA, USA
Been thanked: 6 times

Re: Spot the similarities

Post by iain1967s »

There is of course the possibility that whoever purchased the car on its EBW 177B age-related plate did the research on the chassis number, found that the original reg would have been AHY 990B, then went the V765 route via DVLA to reclaim the original plate. But that wouldn’t explain how EBW 177B could then be sold on with another shell... :roll:
Post Reply