steering rack ,

[swifty]

hi, what is the difference between mk1 and mk2 steering racks . if they are indeed different can i use a mk2 rack on a mk1 . i will be using 7.5 inch cooper s discs and shafts . thanks

[Spider]

They are different and in short, the MKII will give a tighter turning circle BUT you also have to be sure to fit MKII type Steering Arms as well.

From the very distant memory, the MKI rack had 15 teeth and the MKII had 25.

[1071 S]

Mk II rack (and steering arms) were a straight swap into my Mk I - so the reverse won't be a problem.

Except, the larger turing circle (something approaching an extra 3 feet) might not be welcome...

(Which is the reason I went to the MkII version...

Cheers, Ian

[swifty]

Thanks , would anyone have a picture of the mk1 and mk2 steering arms next to each other so i could see the difference . thanks

[1071bob]

The Mk2 arms have two small 'ears' where the track rod end goes. More info here :-
http://www.minispares.com/search/classi ... 0arms.aspx

[Spider]

Thanks , would anyone have a picture of the mk1 and mk2 steering arms next to each other so i could see the difference . thanks

Just so happens



MKII is under, MKI is on top.

The MKII type is the more straighter of the 2. Off-set for MKI is 1.53" and for MKII is 1.30". They are also very slightly different lengths, the MKII being longer (although you wouldn't think so looking at that pic!).

[swifty]

Thanks everyone

[1071 S]

OK ..I'm confused. The MSpares link shows what i've always understood to be Mk I and II arms - Mk II with "ears" as stated, and MkI without..

However, the photo posted shows two arms bolted together to illustrate the different geometry - but both have ears ???????????????

Is one of the pair perhaps a Mk II non Mini ???

Cheers, Ian

[graham in aus]

Spider is in Aus, I think that might be the difference, certainly in UK, I believe your 'ears and no ears' is correct.

G

[1071 S]

Must admit I've not seen an Oz arm with ears... Are there some??

Actually the two pictured arms seem slightly odd..I would suggest they both bend have the same angle of bend (unlike the Mk I/II arms I have) but the lower arm just seems to have a longer lower section... ???

Cheers, Ian

[goff]

1071s, Spider is correct about the MK1 and MK2 steering rack and arms, the arms are quite different as the photo shows , Maybe the arms with out ears that Minispares are selling ( MK1 ) are non genuine, I have some MK1 original arms and they have ears !!!!!!!!!

Different subject ,Just a little info on early MK1 S steering arms

I have a set of early MK1 Cooper S hubs that are fitted with the thinner 850 Mini standard arms, After doing some research i found out that the first S cars were fitted with these arms and they( BMC ) found that during racing that they were bending so were beefed up, These cars were first 1071S
Regards
Goff

[Spider]

As Graham in Aust has said, I am in Australia, we only ever had MKI type arms (on Minis, which our production ceased in 1978), most where the thin type, the only vehicles to get the thicker ones where the S's and Big Wheel Mokes. As goff has said and I do also recall that the very early Ss did have the thinner arms but I'm not sure when our production changed. The Big Wheel Mokes did eventually go over to the MKII Arms (along with a UK MKII Rack) in very late 81, but then they ceased production in 82

[Sean1380]

AND i put Mk2 arms on my Mk1 rack, with -ve camber I would run out of adjustment before i could get the toe adjust right !!!

I used the Midget rack rod ends so that i had enough thread available, but changed to the Mk1 arms in the end.

[Spider]

AND i put Mk2 arms on my Mk1 rack, with -ve camber I would run out of adjustment before i could get the toe adjust right !!!

I used the ends so that i had enough thread available, but changed to the Mk1 arms in the end.

Fit Triumph Spitfire Rod Ends

This might also be helpful http://www.mokesinc.org/index.php/topic,8510.0.html

[1071 S]

"...Spider is correct about the MK1 and MK2 steering rack and arms, the arms are quite different as the photo shows..."

Its not the difference I'm disputing, its whether Mk I arms had ears...and so whether the photo actually depicts Mk I and II arms....

We only had Mk I arms in Oz and they don't have ears.. When I bought my MkII rack from Mspares many years ago they pointed out that I should make sure I used MKII arms ..and that I would recognise same by their ears...

At that time such items were unheard of in Oz so I had to get them from the UK.

I have never (sic) seen a technical bulletin that recommends that you measure the bend in the arm to ensure you have the matched items. So, if you don't measure them how do you tell the difference??

In any case I know of several cars with mismatched parts. The owners either didn't know or didn't care. When I pointed out the difference their opinion was that as they hadn't ever noted a problem they would stick with what they had. I'm told the only real consequence has something to do with Ackermann angles and for practical purposes only comes into play at full lock..

Cheers, Ian

[LDR209H]

Most seem to have something resembling a part number on them. Surely this can be correlated to make some sense ?

[Spider]

In Australia, they did make their own steering arms, so the UK ones may differ from this, I'll check for sure latter but I seem to recall that the thicker arms (commonly but incorrectly referred to as Cooper S ones) had the ears and the thinner ones did not. I'm Probably opening one of those can's of worms here, but I say that - at least in Aust - the arms are incorrectly referred to as Cooper S, they infact were also fitted to the Cooper S as well as Clubman GT and many Big Wheel Mokes.

I don't have a TB on the steering arms, however the parts book does show the change of arms (and rack)

[1071 S]

I think your recall is not what it used to be....

I've seen plenty of (Oz) Mk I (so called??) "S" arms - which are indeed thicker than the ordinary kind - but none had ears. I would also suggest they are called "S" arms because that's what they were made for - long before there were 1275GTs or big wheel Mokes...

I think I'm being thick ..but can someone translate the TB for me??? Are they talking about Oz?? Did we build LHD Minis?? When/what type of Mini was VIN 106393?? Does the TB indeed refer to the end of Oz rack production some time in the late 70s perhaps?? Are there Oz built cars with Mk II UK racks from new???

Cheers, Ian

[Spider]

I think your recall is not what it used to be....

Maybe not. It is old and but well travelled

I've seen plenty of (Oz) Mk I (so called??) "S" arms - which are indeed thicker than the ordinary kind - but none had ears. I would also suggest they are called "S" arms because that's what they were made for - long before there were 1275GTs or big wheel Mokes...

That may well be the case and I'd guess that the early MKI Aust Cooper S had imported Arms, but that is only a guess, I haven't looked.

I think I'm being thick ..but can someone translate the TB for me??? Are they talking about Oz?? Did we build LHD Minis?? When/what type of Mini was VIN 106393?? Does the TB indeed refer to the end of Oz rack production some time in the late 70s perhaps?? Are there Oz built cars with Mk II UK racks from new???

Cheers, Ian

It's not a TB, it from a parts book or to be correct, a fiche. Yes, they are talking about Australian Production. Yes, we did make a small number of LHD Minis but that is actually from the last Moke Parts Listing (apologies, I should have spelt that out with the listing). The change over time was around mid 1980, after Mini production had ceased. There are no Aust Made Minis that were factory fitted with UK MKII racks, only Mokes.

Here's the whole page, I only posted that bit earlier to make it easier to read as they are not a real clear copy



and this is the one that covers the LHD racks, you'll see the Aust made ones have the same ones as fitted to the Minis

[winabbey]

Mainly for the benefit of the Aussies amongst us, below is the Bulletin referred to in Spider's post. I am assured by a very knowledgeable individual here in Oz that the change back to UK racks was because the Australian rack manufacturer went out of business.