Ball Joint questions

[croc7]

Now, with plenty of time on my hands, I plan on replacing ball joints. On this forum, I’ve read that lapping the joint makes shimming easier. So my questions are 1) lap all three components; cup, ball pin and retainer as an assembly? 2) use fine valve lapping paste? 3) OK to use drill motor or lap the parts by hand? 4) to insure grease passage, cut a shallow groove on opposite sides of the ball pin or is a single groove sufficient?
Thanks to all-stay safe
Jerry

[Stopped-again]

Hiya, lapping ball joints doesn’t particularly make shimming easier but what it does do is make the ball joints last a lot longer before they go loose. Use fine paste on new joints on the ball and retaining nut only, no benefit doing the small cup. Put tape round the threads and use a drill on a fairly slow and steady speed, much like you would grind valves in by hand, keep checking that the grey colour is uniform over the whole of the two faces. When done make sure that there are still two flats or grooves on opposite sides of the ball to ensure good greasing, if not put some in. When it comes to tightness of the ball joint when assembled there are many schools of thought, mine is for road use the joint should be hard to move with your thumb but easier with a ring spanner on the nut. Hope this helps, cheers and stay safe.

[bpirie1000]

Also depends on which supplier you have chosen.

I have found that there are a lot of difference between suppliers and quality of parts unfortunately...

Do not be afraid to send things back is what I have found..

[dklawson]

I agree with both of the above. The only new comment I will offer is to not use the drill motor but make and use a lever/handle that you can thread onto the stem of the ball joint post. Manually work that lever in a figure-8 pattern while you gently tighten the domed nut by hand. I find it a bit awkward to use the drill but to each his own.

The following are just a couple of suggestions for things I have found useful. Do not throw out the old shims when you remove the old ball joint. Save the old shims for re-use as necessary. The assembly drawings show the components assembled in the order: hub, lock tab, shims, and domed nut. I deviate slightly from this. I assemble: hub, shims, lock tab, domed nut. This order means when you tightened the domed nut you are tightening against the much heavier, thicker lock tab and not on those delicate shims.

[croc7]

Thanks all for the replies. I did the lapping of the ball joints with the domed nut held in a vise and used the cup to put pressure on the ball pin while spinning it with a drill motor. A little awkward but worked OK. Another question is how much more difficult would it be to replace the ball joints in place rather than removing the hub, et al? Would it be just fussy or a royal pain?

[Herbert]

What Ive always found is that its best to do them Tighht the first time. Dont hammer the lock tab the first time. Do about 20 miles and then re-shim them. When I did this last was 2012 and they are still ok.

[winabbey]

The assembly drawings show the components assembled in the order: hub, lock tab, shims, and domed nut. I deviate slightly from this. I assemble: hub, shims, lock tab, domed nut. This order means when you tightened the domed nut you are tightening against the much heavier, thicker lock tab and not on those delicate shims.

The BMC Australia suspension assembly drawing for the Austin/Morris 1100 does show the sequence you use - hub (BTA362, 63), shims (2A4239, 40, 41) lock tab (2A4238), and domed nut (21A616).

AYG4053 Front Suspension Assembly Ball Pin Details wm.jpg

[Spider]

The assembly drawings show the components assembled in the order: hub, lock tab, shims, and domed nut. I deviate slightly from this. I assemble: hub, shims, lock tab, domed nut. This order means when you tightened the domed nut you are tightening against the much heavier, thicker lock tab and not on those delicate shims.

Doug, I don't disagree with your thinking and method here.

I assemble them as they were in the factory (and as described in the work shop manual) with the shims under the Nut, though, I put the thickest one used directly under the Nut.

I'll also say, of all the Ball Joint assemblies I've dismantled over the years, often with the shims in no particular order, I've not found any that were screwed up or distorted from being assembled that way.

[dklawson]

... I've not found any that were screwed up or distorted from being assembled that way.

Unfortunately when I got my Mini as a project all four ball joints had shims that had been damaged.

Winabbey, thanks for the information on the OZ 1100. It makes you wonder why the assembly order is different between the two cars.