My new project - 1965 Morris Cooper S - HOY 500D

[111Robin]

Thanks Richard and Andy

The determination is that its still the original shell, even if 85% has/will have been replaced. Only a madman would try to save the shell if it wasn't the original one to start with. OK, some would call me mad anyway, but I'm on target to restore the car for no more than what that Mk1 project recently sold for (and that includes buying the car). Obviously this is doing the work myself and not counting time !!

Quite agree Andrew. My Mk2 shell was really bad but it was still original. Looks like you will be replacing steel to the same extent as well. Definitely not the easiest or cheapest option but the right decision.

[Andrew1967]

What would be the cost difference between rebuilding this one, and a new Heritage shell? Obviously the new one would require a few hours of remedial work to get it up to spec.

That depends if your hours are billable or not!

If a shop were doing this restoration, there's no way it would be less than a new Heritage shell. But for DIY, in your workshop, panels are cheap compared to the complete shell. It's the time putting it all together..

The time is my own so I never count the hours. Yes, a Heritage shell would probably be easier and quicker but then its just another reshelled S.

On a DIY basis it'll certainly cost less than a new shell (12k ?) to restore the car.

I'm sure Dad and my other half would sometimes disagree, but I do actually enjoy the challenge of a big restoration

[Highnumbers]

Good on ya, Andrew.

In my opinion, the worst possible hours spent on a project would be the fettling required to get a $12K Heritage shell up-to-spec and looking right. They're a damn good start, but at that price I'd want it ready for a scuff n' prime.

It'll all be worthwhile when you're done restoring this one, and a lot of the work is already done. Hang in there!

[Andrew1967]

Some more progress over the last few days...

Now started to plug weld some of the panels together but not going too mad and getting too carried away.

Took out the n/s rear pocket tonight and trial fitted the MiniMachine Mk1 rear pocket. Nice quality panel but I note that it appears too high at the front, as the ashtray panel is not in the correct position.

Anyone else had this problem ?

The easiest solution to my mind is to release the ash tray panel from the B post and raise it up the few mm rather than cut and shorten the pocket.

[IAIN]

I have found that the pocket is not always a good fit to the floor angles. I would make sure the pocket is fitting the floor then check your measurements from the roof gutter to the sill seam. The problem could be that the floor is too high. You don't want that ! you might find later you have no gap between the door step and the bottom of the door.

[Andrew1967]

Floor should be ok Iain as I was careful to leave panels (like the original pockets) in place whilst getting the floor into place. The new rear quarter fits perfectly as well so. So probably (?!) no issues with the floor height. Will measure upper rail to top pocket on the other side and compare.

The new pocket does seem a bit higher when offering up the old panel and the curve isn’t quite right floor to pocket as you say.

[Dearg1275]

Andy,
I tackled the floor on my 1960 in the same way leaving the rear pockets in. I have left the new ones to be fitted later once the shell has been blasted. I just tried them in again and the pockets do come too high.

Checking against my Mk2 (original pockets) they are 5mm taller next to the ash tray. In the car it seems more, as the fit to the floor is not spot on.

I’m not sure the eye would see it on the finished car as long as both pockets are being replaced. If you wanted to drop them you could re-fold the base or, perhaps easier, slice and weld. You may have trouble fitting the quarter panel card if the ash tray corner sits too much higher.

Interested to here what you decide.

David

[Highnumbers]

Anyone else had this problem ?

The easiest solution to my mind is to release the ash tray panel from the B post and raise it up the few mm rather than cut and shorten the pocket.

Had the same exact issue with replacing my rear companion bins, and releasing the ashtray and re-attaching it 1/4” higher was the most sensible solution. I did adjust the floors as Iain suggested, but ultimately it was the poor quality panel that was the issue.

At least you have plenty of access there!

[IAIN]

Andrew, I did have this problem with the pocket, but not quite as much as you. I managed to lift the ash tray bracket with out removing it. If you do move the bracket it might make the inside trim panel tight from below the window to the bracket.

[Andrew1967]

Thanks for the replies

It seems that the panels are not quite correct - a shame because other than that issue, I think they are very good panels and good value. At the rear end where it goes under the seat pan and over the top on to the wheel arch, they are excellent.

As has been mentioned by David and Iain which can hopefully be answered by Highnumbers, if the ashtray is raised, can an original trim panel (not the horrendously thick Newton panels) be fitted ?

Yes, plenty of access with no side panel

[Highnumbers]

As has been mentioned by David and Iain which can hopefully be answered by Highnumbers, if the ashtray is raised, can an original trim panel (not the horrendously thick Newton panels) be fitted ?

That's a good point! Hadn't even thought of that yet..

I am a long way from starting with the interior kit (mine is from Newton), but I hope it will be fine. We're talking 1/4" or less here, so I'm assuming it would fit with some fettling.


- Collin

[Andrew1967]

The Newton panels are nice Collin but are (or were) a bit on the thick side and difficult to bend into place. Plan to fit once and once only !

Anyone else with any thoughts/experience on fitting the panels with a raised ashtray ??

[Nick W]

Hi Andrew
I would keep the ash tray at the original hight , and trim the panel .
If its trimmed from the top you can re joggle the step back in, but I would just fold the bottom return over with a metal block and hammer, and trim the excess metal off after.
No one would notice the ash trays where moved but you will know and thats what matters not what others think.

[Andrew1967]

Hi Nick,

Before your post, I took another look at the issue and decided that lifting the ashtray panel would be easiest and probably wouldn't make any difference to fitting the trim panels (I hope anyway). By the time I came in and saw your post, I'd removed it

Cheers

Andrew

[Nick W]

When I did my shell the trim panels needed a little alteration as they where tight up to the ashtray, just peeled back the brocade and trimmed the card down, no problem.

Nick

[Andrew1967]

Some more progress to report...

Partially welded in the inner arches and the radius arm shroud captive nuts (thanks to Peter L for making these for me ) and the 'factory jig' mount brackets.

Just borrowed a spot welder (thanks, Scott and Jeremy) as mine is still missing (NOT in action ) so I can spot weld the inner sill reinforcers, and subsequently other panel work) into place. The rear pockets have been welded in.

Just removed the rear bulkhead panel after tacking in some supports to stop the parcel shelf from sagging. Also used some rustic supporting as the pics show The replacement bulkhead (thanks, Gordon) is nearly ready to go in after some minor repair work in the lower corners.

So, here is HOY in her current state

[IAIN]

A point to watch is the distance between the wheel arches. It might not matter depending on how you have fitted things, but what I did was make up a metal bar with two large bolts one at each end that fitted tightly into the shockabsorber holes, this made sure the arches were the correct distance apart. I made the bar up using another unmodified car.
For example, if the arch was leaning out a lot, the wheel arch lip could be too low.

[Andrew1967]

Good tip there Iain.

I have checked such measurements as I’ve gone along and been careful to get it all correct.

I will make up a brace bar of the correct dimensions and fit that as the tank can now come out.

[gogsymac]

That is coming along nicely Andrew. I like the high tech precision jacking set up between the new boot floor and the rear parcel shelf.

[Andrew1967]

Nothing wrong with a bit of rustic support Gordon

I would like to add that I have two pieces of flat bar going from the seat squab fixing holes and tacked to the rear window aperture lip for more rigid support. You can see the pieces of flat bar in the picture.