mk1-forum.net

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1965-Austin- ... 500wt_1156

Anyone have an opinion on this one??

Cheers, Ian

something strange with the badges.....

Yes quite a blatant rebadge job there Not even tried to disguise it, quite refreshing really ! On the plus side it looks a decent '66 Mk1 850 though .

1071 S wrote:http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1965-Austin- ... 500wt_1156

Anyone have an opinion on this one??

Cheers, Ian

... my six penneth.. its a bodged 848... cooper my *****!!... seller ought to be done under the trades description act !!!...unless its been completely stripped of relevant bits and bobs !!!... foxy52

foxy52 wrote: seller ought to be done under the trades description act !!!...

Can't see why, it's not like he's made an attempt to make an 850 look like a Cooper S !

Pete wrote:

foxy52 wrote: seller ought to be done under the trades description act !!!...

Can't see why, it's not like he's made an attempt to make an 850 look like a Cooper S !

... can someone enlighten me as regards to angled stiffeners that are hidden behind grilles ,..err.. on bodywork.. i see so many virtical bars when i understood that coopers and s types should all have factory black angled bracket/stiffeners irrespective of body colour ??!! like mine !!.. or did that not apply to any mk 1,s ???.... a tad confused... ..foxy52

It doesn't even have a 1275. From the description It might even be a 998 instead of 850
Does anyone really expect it was resprayed from tweed grey and oew to blue, just to hide the "fact" it is a Cooper S?

Oh yeah, Nice paperwork!

foxy52 wrote: ... can someone enlighten me as regards to angled stiffeners that are hidden behind grilles ,..err.. on bodywork.. i see so many virtical bars when i understood that coopers and s types should all have factory black angled bracket/stiffeners irrespective of body colour ??!! like mine !!.. or did that not apply to any mk 1,s ???.... a tad confused... ..foxy52

Angled stiffeners only came in when oil coolers became standard fitment in '66, before that the front panel was standard. As for being painted black, I've seen quite a few original cars where all the metalwork behind the grill is also painted black.

I believe that all that is up for auction is a set of papers, the remainder is bits of everything. The DF4851 rego number belongs to an 850, first registered in March, '67. The other rego number (HP2848) is no longer on file.

Al

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/used-ca ... 803708.htm

This car comes up in the picture on the car jam web site as DF 4851.

Funny how the plates have been removed.

Hi Paul,
Are you saying the blue Mk2 you have attached the link to is registered under the same DF4851 number as the Mk1 (S) ?? on e-Bay Aussie? If so, the story is getting stranger !!

Al

Yes, if you go onto car jam it also has a picture of the said car, the car that is also for sale on TM.

Pete wrote:

foxy52 wrote: ... can someone enlighten me as regards to angled stiffeners that are hidden behind grilles ,..err.. on bodywork.. i see so many virtical bars when i understood that coopers and s types should all have factory black angled bracket/stiffeners irrespective of body colour ??!! like mine !!.. or did that not apply to any mk 1,s ???.... a tad confused... ..foxy52

Angled stiffeners only came in when oil coolers became standard fitment in '66, before that the front panel was standard. As for being painted black, I've seen quite a few original cars where all the metalwork behind the grill is also painted black.

... ah !! tks for the info pete... i have seen so many old coopers for sale over the year that dont have the angled stiffener (black).. only a virtical bar as per all pre oil cooler minis.. it seems some shells on post 66 cars are incorrect or not even cooper/s shells at all ??!!... i have noticed many late mk 1,2,s and 3,s having these angled stiffeners painted the body colour of the car ?!!!.. i have also seen remains of so called s types with only the virtical sfiffener(obv vehicles ex engine?oil cooler !!?? even some entered in concourse at some shows with the bracket not in black ..??!!... foxy52

foxy52 wrote: i have seen so many old coopers for sale over the year that dont have the angled stiffener (black).. only a virtical bar as per all pre oil cooler minis.. it seems some shells on post 66 cars are incorrect or not even cooper/s shells at all ??!!...

After the best part of half a century of these cars being modified, battered , raced, rallied and rusted out heaps it's no surprise ! I personally wouldn't get too hung up on the finer detail myself, owners didn't in the 60's as they were too busy modifying their cars and having fun with them. In this case there's been some pretty blatant ringing gone on fair enough and yes sellers can 'talk up' their cars sometimes that are obvioulsy not what they're described as but personally I think it's a little sad when owners won't even lift their bonnets anymore for fear of their car being ripped to shreds by the originality police.
Ironically many of the most "correct" restored cars around do tend to be the ones to be the most suspicious about ! Each to their own I suppose but to see a line of identical "correct" "as they left the factory" Coopers at shows nowadays bores the pants off me. Even historic race cars are now built to concourse showroom standard when they definately weren't in period.

Pete wrote:

foxy52 wrote: i have seen so many old coopers for sale over the year that dont have the angled stiffener (black).. only a virtical bar as per all pre oil cooler minis.. it seems some shells on post 66 cars are incorrect or not even cooper/s shells at all ??!!...

After the best part of half a century of these cars being modified, battered , raced, rallied and rusted out heaps it's no surprise ! I personally wouldn't get too hung up on the finer detail myself, owners didn't in the 60's as they were too busy modifying their cars and having fun with them. In this case there's been some pretty blatant ringing gone on fair enough and yes sellers can 'talk up' their cars sometimes that are obvioulsy not what they're described as but personally I think it's a little sad when owners won't even lift their bonnets anymore for fear of their car being ripped to shreds by the originality police.
Ironically many of the most "correct" restored cars around do tend to be the ones to be the most suspicious about ! Each to their own I suppose but to see a line of identical "correct" "as they left the factory" Coopers at shows nowadays bores the pants off me. Even historic race cars are now built to concourse showroom standard when they definately weren't in period.

...mmm all good points pete,.. i am old enough to have been able to drive minis in the 60,s albeit late !!!..as far as aterations/modifications..within 10 or so years of the mini being born and cooper types being younger there were only a few cars being butchered at the time... my love of minis began with seeing a radford cooper s parked in barclay square in 1969 !!!..and lord snowdon bombing around albermarle st and bond street in mayfair same year in his modified green cooper.. !!!...ill always lift the bonnet on mine..!!.my doors are donors from another vehicle as the electric motor had rusted and seized with the tilling wind/up window mech.. so its now manual.....concourse is not for me .. i just like to look at cars in a reasonable state for their age ! and get nostalgic for the years of my youth...!!!... tks for reply .. foxy52....

Pete wrote:After the best part of half a century of these cars being modified, battered , raced, rallied and rusted out heaps it's no surprise ! I personally wouldn't get too hung up on the finer detail myself, owners didn't in the 60's as they were too busy modifying their cars and having fun with them. In this case there's been some pretty blatant ringing gone on fair enough and yes sellers can 'talk up' their cars sometimes that are obvioulsy not what they're described as but personally I think it's a little sad when owners won't even lift their bonnets anymore for fear of their car being ripped to shreds by the originality police.
Ironically many of the most "correct" restored cars around do tend to be the ones to be the most suspicious about ! Each to their own I suppose but to see a line of identical "correct" "as they left the factory" Coopers at shows nowadays bores the pants off me. Even historic race cars are now built to concourse showroom standard when they definately weren't in period.

Crikey Pete, that some of the most lucid sensible stuff I've heard for a long time! We all like to think our cars are correct, but right from day one these vehicles were modified and usually on a budget. People made do, the aim was for a fast great handling Mini......

graham in aus wrote:

Pete wrote:After the best part of half a century of these cars being modified, battered , raced, rallied and rusted out heaps it's no surprise ! I personally wouldn't get too hung up on the finer detail myself, owners didn't in the 60's as they were too busy modifying their cars and having fun with them. In this case there's been some pretty blatant ringing gone on fair enough and yes sellers can 'talk up' their cars sometimes that are obvioulsy not what they're described as but personally I think it's a little sad when owners won't even lift their bonnets anymore for fear of their car being ripped to shreds by the originality police.
Ironically many of the most "correct" restored cars around do tend to be the ones to be the most suspicious about ! Each to their own I suppose but to see a line of identical "correct" "as they left the factory" Coopers at shows nowadays bores the pants off me. Even historic race cars are now built to concourse showroom standard when they definately weren't in period.

Crikey Pete, that some of the most lucid sensible stuff I've heard for a long time! We all like to think our cars are correct, but right from day one these vehicles were modified and usually on a budget. People made do, the aim was for a fast great handling Mini......

Hear,Hear
G

Pete wrote: After the best part of half a century of these cars being modified, battered , raced, rallied and rusted out heaps it's no surprise ! I personally wouldn't get too hung up on the finer detail myself, owners didn't in the 60's as they were too busy modifying their cars and having fun with them.

its funny, id rather see a 'honest' car with wrong parts and 'interesting' history than a box fresh 100% correct perfect car now a days - i think that the cars that have survived as 'wrong-uns' or as examples of what people did to the cars 'back-in-the-day' will, in time be as acepted as been just as interesting to people as the perfect 'too good to use' examples that park in neat rows at car shows.

certainly, its the 'tatty survivors' that are a far more economic prospect (and a far more usable car) to us 'normal folk'


dont get me wrong, i admire greatly someone who can produce a 'perfect example', but id much rather have a car that i can leave parked on the street, or (not that me and mark would EVER do this... ) one that you could have a huge '17 again' handbrake turn competition in the pub car park (it wasnt us mr landlord, honest!!!! )


in the words of one of the members on here who can get perfection in panel gap and paint when he saw my, er, patined example 'what the f**k is that?'

I just think there becomes a 'hive mind' or a party line of what is and isn't acceptable which I'm not tempted to subscribe to. It always makes me giggle when I see a car described as "numbers matching", the numbers seem to be the most important bit for many and are the easiest to recreate !! (unlike the continuous history). I also think it's very curious when people reverse engineer their cars to look correct especially with the date stamps. Don't get me wrong I love it when a car turns up with all it's original components with matching dates, my old 'MEG' was such a car but to add them to a car, FE numbers and the like is like faking it's history.
A good example is my W&P Mk3. It's got a Mk1 rear bulkhead ! and I've had a couple of people who's eyes have virtually popped out of their heads when they've seen it and written it off as phoney (it's actually completely covered by carpet in the boot anyway so not obvious). It's part of the car's history !! it's the original shell and has had that done to it. (lord only knows why but it was heavily vandalised at one time).

Cars have to be restored and preserved at the end of the day so innevitably the choice of what to do with it will always be a difficult one,you don't want to do it badly (don't get me on sailors legs !!).Talking of restored cars there's a film company making a movie about the late 60's Northern Soul scene in Manchester at the moment and despite hundreds of offers are struggling to find period cars and scooters that don't look too nice because cars with any kind of wear are so hard to find. Yours could be perfect Rich !

When all boiled down, what you fellas are discussing is the fact that we all enjoy different aspects of Mini's. We must be careful not to promote our ideals against folk who have different ideals, we don't have the right to do that. The main thing is that we should enjoy what we do, whichever way we do it and our actions or words shouldn't destroy others enjoyment.

There is my sermon !!

Al