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I have spent all winter in the shed trying to make my FIA car competitive and finally, last night I came to the conclusion that historic racing stinks (or rather, there are too many people with more money than I have ). By my reckoning (not taking into account my driving ability) it would take at least four grand in engine and gearbox modifications to get the car up with the top performers and I just thought...."is this all really worth it?"

I am therefore going to have a bash at sprint/hillclimbs which looks more fun.
Problem is......who do I speak to? What is available?

Depending on where you are there are various championships around the conntry. There are also single make challenges like the DEWS series.

I have dabbled in much Hillclimbing & sprinting over the years & would be happy to try and answer any questions you may have.

M

"It would take at least four grand....."

Yup. sums up speed events too.
(reason I gave up - I couldn't justify that cost for less than 4 minutes an event)

Talk to people in your intended class at events. One thing different is that most are open and happy to discuss their car. As posted above, tell us where you are roughly and we can advise on events/championships. Just don't expect to find hill climbs in the south east quarter of the country and be aware it is almost impossible to be competitive in both hill climbs and sprints in the same car without a major spec change.

You could do a lot worse that take a look at this championship:

http://www.classichillclimb.com/#

It is run by the Bugatti Owners Club but is open to all classic saloons/sports cars/race cars built pre-72 and is run on a handicap basis so it is definitely not a requirement to have the most expensive engine to be competitive in the championship.

For reference, Matt Clarke won the championship in his Mini in 2012.

As with all hill climbs and sprints, the events are open to criticism about the lack of track time but this championship attracts a great and friendly bunch of competitors which is a big part of the attraction as far as I am concerned.

Peter

Thanks men!
Also forgot to mention it could be a great way of getting wife actively involved. The classic club looks just the job.
I'm not looking to win, just have fun at a lower cost and with much less paranoia over what material/shape other people's cylinder heads are cast from, etc, etc....
The car will retain its FIA spec so I can gatecrash (and lose at) Masters, HSCC circuit events if I'm flush that month

YMJ wrote:Thanks men!
Also forgot to mention it could be a great way of getting wife actively involved. The classic club looks just the job.
I'm not looking to win, just have fun at a lower cost and with much less paranoia over what material/shape other people's cylinder heads are cast from, etc, etc....
The car will retain its FIA spec so I can gatecrash (and lose at) Masters, HSCC circuit events if I'm flush that month

The beauty of Hillclimbs is the Family atmosphere, I packed in Rallying and went the Hillclimb route just because its more family friendly, ive Hillclimbed for 15 years or so now, (but not always in Minis) , some years twice a year, others 4 or 5 times, it isn't just about the few minutes of competing its about the whole day, the "Craic" etc, and for £100 entry or so, which to be honest is about what it costs me for a family day out, I think its good value, and I get to compete !, and a little less hard on the car components !

33JOY wrote:You could do a lot worse that take a look at this championship:

http://www.classichillclimb.com/#

It is run by the Bugatti Owners Club but is open to all classic saloons/sports cars/race cars built pre-72 and is run on a handicap basis so it is definitely not a requirement to have the most expensive engine to be competitive in the championship.

For reference, Matt Clarke won the championship in his Mini in 2012.

As with all hill climbs and sprints, the events are open to criticism about the lack of track time but this championship attracts a great and friendly bunch of competitors which is a big part of the attraction as far as I am concerned.

Peter

Now then, that does look like a good championship, worth a look at

YMJ wrote:Thanks men!
Also forgot to mention it could be a great way of getting wife actively involved. The classic club looks just the job.
I'm not looking to win, just have fun at a lower cost and with much less paranoia over what material/shape other people's cylinder heads are cast from, etc, etc....
The car will retain its FIA spec so I can gatecrash (and lose at) Masters, HSCC circuit events if I'm flush that month

Beware, more than one husband has let the little woman try the car and found out she is quicker.

I've been doing historics for 5 years now and wonder if I'm in a rut so have thought what else there is. Hill Climbing /Sprinting is certainly poor value / frustrating

Value for money you could try the 24 hour races that some of the Mighty Minis mob have got into. For instance the Anglesey race was around £2500 between 4 drivers but it does give you 6 hours in the seat. I have tentatively asked about such things and although the website is well outdated both Anglesey and Spa are confirmed for this year and I am in touch with them all

http://mini-grand24.com/

Can keep you posted if just racing a Min is what you are after. Other than that HSCC is really still the best value. A series challenge is just that bit more expensive but I may well try a round or so

YMJ wrote: it would take at least four grand in engine and gearbox modifications to get the car up with the top performers and I just thought...."is this all really worth it?"

What makes you think hillclimbing's any different? If it's just about having fun with the right crowd then I'd recommend most of the historic speed events that venues like Shelsley, Prescott, Loton, Harewood and Boness put on but the buzz will never rival that of racing that's probably a given.

I hear that front running Masters type App K Minis are now spending £20K+ just on engines, that does put it out of the reach of peasants like us doesn't it? I'm sure HSCC Class D is also going that way but I know the front running Mini a year or two ago was spending half that, which if it stays in one piece is probably more realistic for Joe Bloggs. What about CTCRC?

Pete wrote:

YMJ wrote: it would take at least four grand in engine and gearbox modifications to get the car up with the top performers and I just thought...."is this all really worth it?"

What makes you think hillclimbing's any different? If it's just about having fun with the right crowd then I'd recommend most of the historic speed events that venues like Shelsley, Prescott, Loton, Harewood and Boness put on but the buzz will never rival that of racing that's probably a given.

I hear that front running Masters type App K Minis are now spending £20K+ just on engines, that does put it out of the reach of peasants like us doesn't it? I'm sure HSCC Class D is also going that way but I know the front running Mini a year or two ago was spending half that, which if it stays in one piece is probably more realistic for Joe Bloggs. What about CTCRC?

Yes Pete. CTCRC is what my old mate Richard Wager is doing now and he cannot understand why I haven't joined him yet. Perhaps I will.
All motorsport is stupid expensive (someone once tried to persuade me that ocean yacht racing was more expensive, but when I showed him the figures, even he admitted I was right!) but the hillclimbing fraternity is definitely more my scene and it was what my old man used to do.
The appendix K class now is evolving at the same rate as modern racing .....last season a competitor was proudly boasting on his website about his 2015 and 2016 historic(?) cars being "in development". If that isn't an oxymoron, what is?
It's been mentioned in a previous thread before so I won't labour it but it's this giant con with regard to reproduction cylinder head castings is what really gets my tits. I still cannot believe its been allowed. I don't mind coming second or even fifteenth but what's the point in racing, knowing full well you will never ever win? Even if you do buy one, how do you know what the exact state of tune will be compared with your competitors?

YMJ wrote:someone once tried to persuade me that ocean yacht racing was more expensive, but when I showed him the figures, even he admitted I was right

I used to race with a bloke who was an ex power boat racer

some of those bills where horrific, he was racing an aston martin v8 just to give his wallet a rest!

Have a look at top end karting for kids aswell, £50K a season?

Pete wrote:Have a look at top end karting for kids aswell, £50K a season?

and they think they are hard done too with an equipment disadvantage

ivor badger 2 wrote:

Pete wrote:Have a look at top end karting for kids aswell, £50K a season?

and they think they are hard done too with an equipment disadvantage

don't get me started .....you do everything for them and they just grunt

I enjoy the Hill Climbs and Sprints I do, but I must admit it was (is) more about having a good day out with friends than winning championships, at some events I will be quicker, at others they will due to the different dif ratio's ect ect that everyone has chosen.

I've tried to keep a balance with what's been done to the car so that it can still be driven on the road and driven to (and hopefully from ) events so that when I decide to stop competing I won't have to take the car apart to enjoy it still.

It is a lot of money for not a lot of seat time, but you can do the road going classes without to much expense (once you are kitted out with the safety equipment)

We have a series here in NZ called classic trials. The events are run on race tracks with a variety of classic vehicles in each event. The idea is that you do a timed practice session then review lap times and nominate a time that you think you can consistently replicate. Then there are 3 10 lap race sessions where you try to lap as close to your chosen time as possible. If you want to go hell for leather that's fine, as long as you are consistent. Winner can be any vehicle on the circuit, regardless of HP etc. not exactly door to door racing but a good chance to get out on the track with other vehicles, learn your race lines and master your vehicle without needing to spend moonbeams, plus a chance to win even in a mini.