mk1-forum.net

Another well thought out breath of fresh air from 111Robin. Just sufficient words to carry the day as well............

I concede. You were right. The whole EV thing is a joke. Poor infrastructure and reliability proving appalling after just 4000 miles. The Tesla would not hold charge this morning and the RAC are useless so I had to dismantle it myself. Turns out there’s not much to it after all and completely debunked all this crap about lithium and moving parts. Pics to follow.

Pics as promised. Feckin EV’s eh

rolesyboy wrote: ↑Sat Feb 25, 2023 10:42 am Pics as promised. Feckin EV’s eh

At least they put a Duracell in, could of been even worse

Britain explores a crackdown on brake and tyre wear emissions.....
"Drivers risk being forced to pay a “tyre tax” as Britain explores a crackdown on brake and tyre wear emissions.
Ministers have hired advisers to explore how to address harmful emissions that experts say are more harmful than diesel fumes.
The Department for Transport has asked consultancy Arup to “develop recommendations on how to better assess and control these emissions which will persist after a transition to zero tailpipe emission vehicles”, according to a Government filing.
Although the Whitehall officials this weekend insisted that Arup’s work was not designed to inform tax policy, it is being seen as one of the strongest signals yet that a tyre tax is coming down the road.
Andy Turbefield, head of quality at Halfords, said: “Putting a tax on road safety is not the right way to plug the fuel duty gap. Worn tyres and faulty brakes are two of the biggest causes of accidents.
“As it is, many motorists are delaying tyre replacement and basic maintenance because of the cost-of-living crisis. Using the tax system to penalise people for keeping their vehicles in a roadworthy condition is not a good policy.”
Tyre and brake wear pollution is expected to be the next battleground for clean air campaigners after drivers switch to electric vehicles.
Particles sent into the air – known as “particulate matter (PM) 2.5” – are more harmful than nox emissions that have been the target of low-emissions zones such as Sadiq Khan’s Ulez in London.
Although tyre technology has developed to reduce dangerous emissions, the Environment Department said last week that non-exhaust road emissions have “remained largely unchanged between 1996 and 2021”
Mr Turbefield added: “If taxing non-exhaust emission is to be considered, then there needs to be more research into emissions from road surface wear. It’s plausible that electric vehicles, which are much heavier than petrol vehicles, cause more damage to road surfaces and are therefore a bigger source of road surface emissions. Any review needs to take account of the big picture.”
A Government spokesman said: “We want to better understand the impacts of non-exhaust emissions, such as tyres, on the environment which is why we’re conducting research on the matter. This research was not commissioned to inform tax policy development.
“As we continue to deliver on our target to meet Net Zero by 2050, we are committed to keeping the switch to electric vehicles affordable to consumers, which is why we are spending billions to help incentivise uptake and fund the rollout of charging infrastructure across the UK.”
In May Professor Alastair Lewis, chairman of the Department for Transport Science Advisory Council, said: “When everybody owns a low emissions vehicle, low emission zones become a toothless control lever to try to manage air pollution."
“A world where we [have] jam-packed roads full of electric cars [also] isn’t a particularly attractive one… Even if they are electric, [they] will generate lots of particles.”
“At some point in the future when most of those cars have disappeared, a different form of air pollution control” is likely to be needed, he added.
“We do have to project forward about how we’re going to manage vehicles in large cities like London in the future when we have a largely electrified fleet of vehicles.”
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/20 ... emissions/

I wouldn't be to happy paying a 'tyre tax' when 2 weeks ago I had to replace 2 perfectly good tyres due to damage from a pot hole on a poorly maintained road, even after filling in all the (extensive) forms for the local authority all I got back was 'Section 58', we had done all that we should of this was the reason, from the start of this thread, that I had a Nissan leaf for a week.

Aren't Tesla being sued by a government over lying about range?

A mate has an electric Kia co.car. He isn't paying a grand or whatever to install a home charger for a car he doesn't own so you need to find a charge point. In Cheltenham this appears to be a bit of a problem. You get to one and assuming the charger works and the cable hasn't been chopped off (that always makes me chuckle), there is always a queue and apparently Teslas using non Tesla charging points (?)

He went for a Kia on the basis of Kia being a proper car company and whilst it drives well, charging it is just a pain in the arse.

Values of used electric cars are dropping significantly now as potential buyers are waking up to the reality.

111Robin wrote: ↑Wed Feb 22, 2023 5:29 pm

rolesyboy wrote: ↑Wed Feb 22, 2023 4:41 pm https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/uk ... s-23963330#

He sounds like a dick, he drove it until "the engine went bang", probably would wreck an EV just the same. £2k per year warranty, seriously ?.

No, JLR stuff really is absolute junk.

EV's will be the same other mass produced electrical goods - cheap junk, cheap junk with a nice badge/price tag and then decent stuff.

Costafortune wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 1:46 pm Aren't Tesla being sued by a government over lying about range?

A mate has an electric Kia co.car. He isn't paying a grand or whatever to install a home charger for a car he doesn't own so you need to find a charge point. In Cheltenham this appears to be a bit of a problem. You get to one and assuming the charger works and the cable hasn't been chopped off (that always makes me chuckle), there is always a queue and apparently Teslas using non Tesla charging points (?)

He went for a Kia on the basis of Kia being a proper car company and whilst it drives well, charging it is just a pain in the arse.

Values of used electric cars are dropping significantly now as potential buyers are waking up to the reality.

Dunno. I am not aware of any substantive efforts to sue by the government?? Is this happening? Is it in the UK?
Maybe Tesla have under reported ? The warm weather seems to be increasing my range by the day....
I know VW (and lots of other ICE manufacturers) faced legal challenges on emissions a while back.

I haven't found a chopped off cable yet. I hope its not any forum members with a grudge against EV's
If he won't pay for a charging point that's a choice he's made. The EV chargepoint grant provides funding of up to 75% towards the cost of installing electric vehicle smart chargepoints at domestic properties across the UK. Presumably he's in it for a while so probably beneficial in the middle-long term.

Teslas using non Tesla charging points. That's shocking. Surely there must be some kind of by-law that a Tesla driver is obligated to only use Tesla charge points. As an absolute minimum if a Tesla owner is found using these sites the local authorities should impound their cars and the Kia owners, and whoever else has the God-given right to these charge points, should publicly chop the ends of their charging cables off. That would sort this National Crisis out.

Re Values of electric cars dropping off?? That is almost inevitable for any mainstream vehicle as more and more EV's come on to the market.
I don't believe its a case of buyers waking up to the reality. Its based on fleets buying masses of cars and reaching the end of leasing agreements.
There will be a glut of EVs which are 3-5 years old by now as they reach the end of term. In the same way your new 3 series or Honda does 3-5 years after the launch of a new model. Granted the fact that EV's bucked the typical trend and retained their value so well in the first few years is an impressive feat.

Personally I haven't found charging a PITA. Just push a plug in to a socket, be it 3 pin 13a, home charger or at a Charging station?? I still haven't found myself flustered or in any kind of blind panic in 4 months.
We roll....

Ah........ Good response from Roly (above) except that at the end of the last sentence, you missed out the last word. '......YET'

That's because while it's all bright and shining at the moment, as sure as god made little green apples, as most other EV drivers have found out and are deserting them in droves, there will be charging problems.........., usually when you ain't at home!

But I'm an optimist Pete
Yep as sure as god did.... I will put money on it somebody runs out of petrol somewhere today because they are badly organised.
Its the same with an EV. It just doesn't make the headlines if somebody runs their car out of juice and the owner starts stamping their feet saying "this is a travesty. I bought that car in good faith and they haven't installed a charge point at the location I ran out.. 'yet' "
The range is displayed on the dash. Its the same principle as having a tank of fuel. The gauge is progressive and what these dummies neglect to recognise is that as you drive a car the range goes down. If you press the gas pedal harder it goes down faster. If you feather the throttle it goes down less quickly
God help me if I ever run out of charge but I promise you if I do I will shoulder the blame and wont be running off to the local Gazette saying it was everybody else's fault.
And I definitely won't be telling Costa

An interesting video on JCB and their development of the hydrogen powered engine. Seems strange that the UK government appear to be ignoring this as a parallel option to EVs.

https://youtu.be/jxtxZY45RMM

111Robin wrote: ↑Tue Mar 07, 2023 12:51 pm An interesting video on JCB and their development of the hydrogen powered engine. Seems strange that the UK government appear to be ignoring this as a parallel option to EVs.

https://youtu.be/jxtxZY45RMM

You may think about the government whatever - but possibly they are not so stupid in every respect.

I am repeating myself, groundhog day time again.
Hydrogen is very wasteful in production (cue: losses in transformation and transport). Very inconveniant at the re-fill station (f.k.a. petrol station) cause it ices up around the filler neck. This means waiting time...
To produce it in the quantities required for cars, means it's gonna be made from methan (i.e. the mega-greenhouse gas) under a lot of CO2 emission on top from production and transport. I.e. this sso called grey and blue hydrogen is sanything but environmentally friendly, nor has it a positive effect on greenhouse gas emissions, nor is cleaner than pure electricity and it certainly is very expensive and scarce.
We will need more than all yet sustainably produced* hydrogen (10% currently) for lorries, ships, planes, metal works, etc.

*from wind and solar

MiNiKiN wrote: ↑Tue Mar 07, 2023 10:26 pm

111Robin wrote: ↑Tue Mar 07, 2023 12:51 pm An interesting video on JCB and their development of the hydrogen powered engine. Seems strange that the UK government appear to be ignoring this as a parallel option to EVs.

https://youtu.be/jxtxZY45RMM

You may think about the government whatever - but possibly they are not so stupid in every respect.

I am repeating myself, groundhog day time again.
Hydrogen is very wasteful in production (cue: losses in transformation and transport). Very inconveniant at the re-fill station (f.k.a. petrol station) cause it ices up around the filler neck. This means waiting time...
To produce it in the quantities required for cars, means it's gonna be made from methan (i.e. the mega-greenhouse gas) under a lot of CO2 emission on top from production and transport. I.e. this sso called grey and blue hydrogen is sanything but environmentally friendly, nor has it a positive effect on greenhouse gas emissions, nor is cleaner than pure electricity and it certainly is very expensive and scarce.
We will need more than all yet sustainably produced* hydrogen (10% currently) for lorries, ships, planes, metal works, etc.

*from wind and solar

I said "in parallel to the EV"
Thanks for the lesson.

Putting the question of hydrogen supply aside for a moment

I think its interesting how JCB are also being driven (scuse pun) by who and where their products (these are all just products) are serviced and fixed by - no use having a vehicle without a dealer network equipped to repair it.

Apparently, they have 700 odd thousand dealers world wide all who understand and are equipped to work on ICE engines - in broad terms, their solution is just changing the fuel....

The current EV solution( maybe it will change) seems best suited to use in metropolitan areas....or for shorter journeys

This is the crux. We are being pushed into EVs as the only option yet they will just not be suitable for all regions or operating requirements. All of the options should be made available, including highly efficient low emission ICE vehicles. By all means fully electrify densely populated cities, that is a great solution and it would work perfectly in most cases and would encourage the use of public transport. I'm not an "EV hater", I just want to have the choice of transport mode to suit my needs.

My Brother has run an Audi e-tron for the last 3 years, he had to borrow my car when he went down to London to see his Son & has to stop for a quick recharge between Harrogate & Lincoln, a journey he does regularly. In the three years he had it, it had a number of factory recalls & the suspension collapsed 3 times. He's just got rid & replaced it with a Hybrid Range Rover Velar.

I hope I never have to buy an electric car.

I'm not a "hater" by any means, I think they are a reasonable solution for some peoples transport requirements. If you are buzzing round a city where you are making short journeys & you have access to decent charging facilities they are fine, if you live in the middle of nowhere or do a lot of miles, a lot of things need to improve a lot before they are a real option.

This makes interesting reading.

https://www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/busines ... -vehicles/

likewise, not an EV hater, actually, I quite fancy one for work, just couldn`t find one for a sensible price that would do what we needed...

I dont think the servicing repair network question is to be under estimated, apparently (according to internet https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... ountrywide.) Tesla have just 30 service centres in the UK and they make a point of owning them all

Is this enough for the whole UK ? doesn't sound enough to me - could certainly be an issue for them if they get significant recalls.

Prices will now start to drop to more attainable levels as 3-5 year old fleets of EV's go to auction. Anything novel starts off as expensive. Gradually as more manufacturers play catch up there will be more cars available to choose from which in turn dilutes the value of the existing, comparatively small pool of EV's and thereafter the values of these cars.
They are genuinely a great option but it isn't for everybody at this point in time. If you live in a rural area and do long journeys day in day out and you are doing this at pace then clearly choosing an EV would likely be a badly thought through decision.
Give it a few years and there will likely be a natural transition to EV's becoming mainstream (unless Porsche pull this synthetic fuel out of the bag, which I would love, but I suspect that will end up as a 'Betamax')

Having had a new Honda Civic, Audi A4, Golf, BMW 330d and 530e over the last 10 years I will say that all have had manufacturer recalls. It certainly isnt exclusive to EVs. The BMW's were the most frequent inc. EGR coolers that threatened to catch fire and various other bits and bobs. I looked on this as an opportunity to drive a new M3 or convertible for the day while my own car got a free valet
(Bizarrely my Audi A4 had 7 replacement windscreens in 70k miles??? Yet I haven't had a screen in any of the others??)

rolesyboy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 06, 2023 6:32 pm Dunno. I am not aware of any substantive efforts to sue by the government?? Is this happening? Is it in the UK?

South Korea.