ACS 65C - Mk 1 Cooper S

[richardACS]

Would I be incorrect in thinking that in 1965 the bumpers had a 7 hole fixing or has it always been 5?

Also, in 1965 what material were the bumpers formed from?

Thanks

[Costafortune]

Any updates on this?

[richardACS]

Fingers crossed nearly ready to report further!

Have been acquiring parts and awaiting completion of engine/gearbox rebuild and a date in the paint shop. Presently this autumn is looking good, have not been pushing as life has been full with aged family issues but hope this will now start to gain momentum to the finish line, hopefully early in 22....

[richardACS]

I'm now completing 1st fix prior to the car going into paint - would I be correct in believing the Old English White (from 1965 era) was actually a more creamy finish than a striking white?

[Peter Laidler]

Yes, OEW was certainly a more creamy white. It was certainly a creamy white compared with Glacier and snowberry.

[richardACS]

Thank you Peter....

[Nick W]

I did mine nice and creamy

[richardACS]

Nick - I had one in that colour combo back in the 70's - wish I hadn't sold it.

Lovely car and yet it does appear more white than the creamy finish I find on my wheels - a subtle difference but I'm guessing it might depend on the paint supplier. In fact does your front wheel look a little more creamy or is the light?

[mk1]

That's because wheels weren't painted OEW. They were painted a slightly darker cream colour.

Wheels being painted OEW is a TOTAL MYTH!

[richardACS]

That's because wheels weren't painted OEW. They were painted a slightly darker cream colour.

Wheels being painted OEW is a TOTAL MYTH!

Thank you - there we have it then!

[richardACS]

With the car going into paint I'm hoping to get all the bits painted at the right time and not find something's been missed once I get into assembly. A few questions if I may....

1) The wooden spare wheel cover - has three support brackets on the boot opening which are pop riveted into position - are the support brackets painted off the car? and then the pop rivets touched in with paint or are they fixed first and the inside of the brackets just get a dusting?

2) The door openings have the 'plate buffer' s - are they painted along with the screw heads off the car?

3) The striker plates - are not painted?

4) On this 1965 car the oil cooler was the first type that was situated low down in front of the engine i.e. not mounted on the front panel behind the grille. Therefore did the front panel have a vertical support from somewhere around the catch plate?

However, I've heard the earlier oil coolers suffered from vibration fatigue and this would not be clever for a union to let go and bugger a rebuilt engine - better to fit the later type oil cooler mounted to the front panel? and if so who produces an authentic look a like? If this is the route go then I guess no vertical support would be required?

5) Where self tapping screws are used for example piano hinges, front side window felt guides, front grille etc etc, these will be full of paint - how to deal with the metal once the paint has been broken? - I'm contemplating using a rivnut on the most 'used' positions - for example front grille - would welcome views on this?

6) Same applies to where pop rivets are used?

7) On many of the existing cross headed screws some of which are chrome and have the cross head either damaged or have rust in the recess - is it possible to find these new and if so is there a supplier?

8) In the position of the 'grease nipple' on the rear swing arm are the small decorative covers which take the rubber grommets, the new floor fitted does not have a provision for the fixings - were these a threaded fixing and if so what size or were they a self tapper?

9) I'm sorting through the old parts making up lists for parts to purchase:

a) Where can I find the best quality ball joints, rubber dust covers for the suspension areas i.e. to avoid cheap chinese items?

I appreciate this is a long list but would welcome the depth of experience....

b) The washer bottle is very yellow and badly marked - is anyone making a genuine new copy?

c) The chrome items such as:
rear lamp casings
door and boot handles
rear window frames
badges
bumper overriders
moustache and whiskers
front grille - (Austin not Morris)
are not in terrible rusty condition but not great - is it best to get these replated or to purchase new?

d) The original bumpers have dents and missing fixings - new ones? and if so which are better and from whom?

Thanks in advance - a long list I know!

[mk1]

1) The wooden spare wheel cover - has three support brackets on the boot opening which are pop riveted into position - are the support brackets painted off the car? and then the pop rivets touched in with paint or are they fixed first and the inside of the brackets just get a dusting?
Brackets are fixed to the car & painted with the shell.

2) The door openings have the 'plate buffer' s - are they painted along with the screw heads off the car?
Plate buffers are body colour & are usually painted on the car although you could do them off & fit later.

3) The striker plates - are not painted?
Striker plates should be fixed to the car before painting & be painted on the car. Although it seems to be the fashion nowadays to leave them unpainted.

4) On this 1965 car the oil cooler was the first type that was situated low down in front of the engine i.e. not mounted on the front panel behind the grille. Therefore did the front panel have a vertical support from somewhere around the catch plate?
No, it would have had a standard MK1 front panel with a diagonal stiffener.

However, I've heard the earlier oil coolers suffered from vibration fatigue and this would not be clever for a union to let go and bugger a rebuilt engine - better to fit the later type oil cooler mounted to the front panel? and if so who produces an authentic look a like? If this is the route go then I guess no vertical support would be required?
You do need to keep an eye on these early oil cooler pipes, but catastrophic failure is unlikely nowadays with the type of driving most of these cars get. Personally, I'd stick with the original set up. If you did want to go for a panel mounted one, then any "off the shelf" 10 row cooler is as good as anyone would want. If you did do this then you would ahve to eliminate the vertical stiffener.

5) Where self tapping screws are used for example piano hinges, front side window felt guides, front grille etc etc, these will be full of paint - how to deal with the metal once the paint has been broken? - I'm contemplating using a rivnut on the most 'used' positions - for example front grille - would welcome views on this?
I have gone the rivnut route in the past, but in service these are not really any better than the original self tappers, they tend to stick after having been around a while. I wouldn't go that route again. The correct self tappers are perfectly adequate in normal service.

6) Same applies to where pop rivets are used?
Up to you, but I tend to stick with original style fastenings where possible. A wipe over with some sort of wax or polish usually keeps the rot at bay.

7) On many of the existing cross headed screws some of which are chrome and have the cross head either damaged or have rust in the recess - is it possible to find these new and if so is there a supplier?
Practically all the fasteners are available in polished stainless steel if you hunt round on ebay or similar. A good swap

8) In the position of the 'grease nipple' on the rear swing arm are the small decorative covers which take the rubber grommets, the new floor fitted does not have a provision for the fixings - were these a threaded fixing and if so what size or were they a self tapper?
I use an M5 Rivnut in the vertical face & a self tapper on the underneath face. M5 is very close to the 3/16 UNF setscrew originally fitted.

9) I'm sorting through the old parts making up lists for parts to purchase:
All good fun. It will probably be a depressing, expensive list when complete-ish.

a) Where can I find the best quality ball joints, rubber dust covers for the suspension areas i.e. to avoid cheap chinese items?
No comment. I use normal stuff and only very rarely have issues. This sort of stuff is a bug bear to some, I just don't let it worry me.

I appreciate this is a long list but would welcome the depth of experience....

b) The washer bottle is very yellow and badly marked - is anyone making a genuine new copy?
There is a very good repro available from most of the usual suspects. http://minispares.com/product/Classic/B ... o%20search

c) The chrome items such as:
rear lamp casings - Repalce, repro are as good as new.
door and boot handles - Replace, all but the passenger door handle, for this either NOS or get it replated.
rear window frames - Rear quarters can usually be "turned" put the inside out & outside in. If this is not an option get the originals replated.
badges - I'd find NOS, replating isn't really an option on these as the polishing process will wreck the badge.
bumper overriders - Replate
moustache and whiskers - I usually use repro, these are pretty good, but if your originals are good enough to replate, do.
front grille - (Austin not Morris) - can't be replated as they are Alloy. The repro is pretty much perfect, so replacement is probably your best bet.
are not in terrible rusty condition but not great - is it best to get these replated or to purchase new?
I have answered these individually above.

d) The original bumpers have dents and missing fixings - new ones? and if so which are better and from whom?
If you can get them restored & they are definitely original then do. I haven't found a really good replacement bumper in a long time.

Hope this helps,

M

[richardACS]

Mark

Thank you for your time and advice - very much appreciated!

[richardACS]

On the question of painting all the black bits i.e. suspension components, tanks, subframes hydrolastic containers etc etc - it appears that the original factory colour used was a black gloss - not a overly shiny black gloss but also not a satin finish and without an undercoat - any idea what was used? More specifically what is being used?

I'm not a fan of powder coat.

Would be interested in thoughts and experience of two pack? and or POR 15? (although have noticed the POR 15 black is very shiny)

[AndyPen]

I always prime then use satin black, once there are a few coats on it get shinier too. I don't attempt to replicated the runs and drips from where they have been dipped originally - but will keep them and overpaint where possible.

Over the years I fit new self tappers with either some fresh paint in the hole or some dryed off wax preserver, having left it to partially dry overnight. Seems to help.

Mark has offered a very comprehensive response, so not much more to add

[mk1]

I find it very easy to replicate the original black finish c/w runs & missed spots. It's called attention to detail (or lack of it)

The original was badly applied semi gloss (usually dipped), personally I prefer a satin finish out of the can. I have never undercoated any parts that are painted black. A couple of reasons, if they get chipped they show up like a bugger, and nothing painted black originally was undercoated, so why should I start now.

[richardACS]

Thanks gents.

I have used Eastwoods satin black out of the can (not on minis) along with their undercoat which is black and they also supply a two pack but this has to be used up once opened and two pack as I understand is not a good substance to be around - I have tried this but not had the opportunity to assess in the long term.

I'm toying with the idea to try POR 15 and mix their satin with the gloss and through a gun - its not as convenient as a rattle can but I think will be a lot quicker than painting POR by hand especially as one has to apply two coats.

[Hipwell]

The POR15 is a little translucent on its own. Its also not UV stable, so they advise to apply 'top coat' aswell.

[mk1]

I have never been a fan of POR15.

[GraemeC]

I find Rustbuster's EM121 Epoxy Mastic good stuff - its a brushable to pack system (can be sprayed too).
https://www.rust.co.uk/product/cat/em-1 ... is-paint-7