First Gear Problems.

[minidean]

UPR Keeps jumping out of first gear especially when going up hills or setting off quickly. Sounds to me like it could be the selector fork in the gear box which I think involves removing the engine (again). I really don't want to do this so does anyone have any other ideas???

[Spider]

What sort of gearbox do you have?

Almost certainly though, it will mean engine out.

As you've said, it will likely be selector fork, but can also be bearings. Usually though, once it's done it a few times, it rounds off the dogs on the gear (assuming it's a 4 synchro box) and that will also need replacing.

if it's a remote shift, there's a possibility that the knuckle joints have come loose or are worn.

[Vegard]

I'd guess its a 3sync?

[Pete]

it's an early '63 with original engine/box. 3 synch pudding stirrer.

[ianh1968]

On those early boxes, aren't there a couple of plungers somewhere that
have a shallow hex head on them. About 1&1/2" apart at the bottom
somewhere. Possibly at the back, on the transmission case end...

It's a while since I had a 3-synchro, but I vaguely remember that my Dad
once put some packing behind the springs to stiffen the detent up a bit.

Did I imagine this, or would this be an easier "fix" than taking the engine out?

I "borrowed" this photo from MiniSpares, so thanks to them...

3sync.jpg

Ian

[minidean]

On those early boxes, aren't there a couple of plungers somewhere that
have a shallow hex head on them. About 1&1/2" apart at the bottom
somewhere. Possibly at the back, on the transmission case end...

It's a while since I had a 3-synchro, but I vaguely remember that my Dad
once put some packing behind the springs to stiffen the detent up a bit.

Did I imagine this, or would this be an easier "fix" than taking the engine out?

I "borrowed" this photo from MiniSpares, so thanks to them...

3sync.jpg

Ian

Thanks Ian,

Anyone got any views on this ??

[rich@minispares.com]

putting washers behind the detent springs is a bit of a bodge, but would assist with a gear that's popping out

the trouble is though, you are only hiding a problem, and you may even make it worse with the extra effort required to defeat the 'uprated' spring

I suppose its worth a try if the engine is in the car as its easy to do (its the top bolt that covers the spring for the 1st / 2nd fork)

but the only real fix is to strip the box and have a look at the fork / syncro hub etc

[Vegard]

putting washers behind the detent springs is a bit of a bodge, but would assist with a gear that's popping out

the trouble is though, you are only hiding a problem, and you may even make it worse with the extra effort required to defeat the 'uprated' spring

I suppose its worth a try if the engine is in the car as its easy to do (its the top bolt that covers the spring for the 1st / 2nd fork)

but the only real fix is to strip the box and have a look at the fork / syncro hub etc

So when is the 3-syncro 1st gear/hub available from Minispares?

[rich@minispares.com]

So when is the 3-syncro 1st gear/hub available from Minispares?

22G1118

shrink a ring on to it, grind the inside and its good to go

[ianh1968]

putting washers behind the detent springs is a bit of a bodge,

Surely no more of a "bodge" than putting a ball or other packing behind the
oil pressure spring to increase the rate... ?


Like you say, it's got to be worth a try!

One point to note is that it may be best to use a socket/ring with a very
shallow chamfer in the end. From what I can remember, it's easy to chew
these heads up as they are not very thick.

I have a couple of used 3 synchro 1st gears, probably 'B' type...
What are they worth?

Ian

[minidean]

Thanks for all you advice guys but I have decided to take the engine out and sort it properly. I say (i) but i really mean the local garage. Im going to get the gearbox restored and there are a few minor oil leeks that can be sorted at the same time. I have also learnt from last time I took the engine out and just ordered a new water pump from minispares. Im also going to whip off the head and check to see if it needs de-coking whilst its out. My challenge now is to get it sorted for Blyton!! Wish me luck!!

[minidean]

I took the engine out and this bit fell out of the socket where the gear stick sits. 1st gear won't select and third is a little dodgy. Could this part be the problem???

[InimiaD]

That looks like the anti rattle plunger and spring Dean. I don't think those bits would adversely effect your gear change problems unless they had come loose and interfered with the base of the gearstick.

[minidean]

I took the engine out and this bit fell out of the socket where the gear stick sits. 1st gear won't select and third is a little dodgy. Could this part be the problem???

I can't see anywhere for this to go? Is it supposed to fit on the gearstick or in the socket somewhere?

Hope you can help?

Thanks

[InimiaD]

There should be a flat (ish) hex bolt head on the l / hand side of the gear stick housing as you look at the back of the gearbox.
It is actually a "cap" which the spring sits inside of and the other end of the spring has the brass? plunger over it.
When the gearstick is taken off the cap bolt should be taken off first with all the bits behind it.

One question, was the above done when the engine unit was removed from the car during it's previous rebuild .?
There's a possibility that the plunger and spring were already in the gear change housing, rattling around loosely and restricting the movement of the gear stick.
If it's 1st and 3rd gears that are difficult to engage this would make sense because 2nd, 4th and reverse are in the opposite direction of the gear stick movement

Try fitting the gear stick back in and see if you can select gears any easier.

Edit. Just checked back on your rebuild thread and the hex bolt (cap) was still in place on the gear change housing and I think I can just see the end of the plunger through the gear stick hole in one pic.
Could this have fallen out at some point, unnoticed, before the unit was put back in.?