Differences between a 72" Clubman and a Mini

[surfblue63]

Ugly as sin. Might have looked better as originally designed; i.e., with the extended Elf/Hornet rear .

I don't think the mutant back end was the pinnacle of the BMC design department (and that's coming from a mutant owner), thank gawd they didn't go for that ! Would have looked like a 'push me pull me' !

You might have seen this one before



and a full sized one was featured in an old Mini book.


That Clubman looks great and shouldn't be chopped up. The colour looks like Bracken to me with a Mink interior.

[Mudhen]

I think it sounds like a good deal...(depending on how much rust of course). Seems like you can't get into any Mini over here anymore for less than $10k unless it's in boxes!

[Chalkie]

You'd be mad to turn that down its well nice!!

[mab01uk]

Seen at last years Brands Hatch Mini Festival

[JC T ONE]

Ugly as sin. Might have looked better as originally designed; i.e., with the extended Elf/Hornet rear .

I don't think the mutant back end was the pinnacle of the BMC design department (and that's coming from a mutant owner),
thank gawd they didn't go for that ! Would have looked like a 'push me pull me' !

Put it this way, W&P didn't convert too many round nosed Minis once the clubman was introduced and they couldn't keep up with demand.

So very true, and also remember that coachbuild Mini,s were always (with a very few exceptions) based on the most expensive Mini model of the day,
as these would feature the biggest engine option (to cope with the extra weight) so the GT was a obvius choise, after the demise of the S.

Another reason for the GT to be preferred by WP, was mr Collins idea with the Vauxhall grill
This enabled W&P to alter the cars overall appearence with minimum of work.

[Ollie78]

Do you know where this clubmans from originally? The front seat design is very slightly different to any UK car I have seen, there are a few things that are a bit strange for a 72 It looks to be in fairly good condition and original though. If it has the body features I mentioned before its an early shell, if not then its somewhere in between early 73 and 76-ish as its a solid mounted car.
Pad4 the exhaust tunnel should be round not square if its a 72 shouldn't it Rod change floors weren't used until Jan 73, it has a rod change gear lever gaiter

[Ollie78]

Yeah interesting JC, are you sure it has the square tunnel or has just the later gaiter been fitted to a remote floor, that floor looks a bit low to be rod change maybe.
My old Black Tulip 1275GT is in America now, I sold it around 14 years ago sadly. I'm afraid I removed many of its original features in my youth as that seemed the thing to do then.

img058.jpg

In my search here in the UK for a replacement clubman a few years ago I found nearly all the supposed pre 72 cars I found were re-shells. It took me a long time to find an affordable original that wasn't completely rotten and its not even complete. As Pete has said most cars have been re-shelled.
I know you have a lot of knowledge on these cars but I've never seen an original pre 73 body with rod change. Look to the rear bulkhead/seat as well, if it has no large oval hole its got to be later.
Ollie

EDIT. Uhhhh... did a post go missing? I thought JC posted something about the seats looking possibly Canadian? or am I losing it.

[wantafaster1]

I've never seen a MK3 era car with the headlining like that on the clubman in America, looks like the older material.

[Ollie78]

Yes I noticed that too, it has a crackle finish, looks like it has no drip rails either. Its not a UK car is it

[yorkspv]

This is my other mini. Not really very original I'm afraid.

[nick@dunsdale]

Centre key start on this car would suggest pre 72. My first car was an 69 clubman in aqua. It also had a centre key start.

[Ollie78]

Yes I forgot about that Nick, I think it was only the very first early ones that had the mk2 switch panel. Probably just using up left overs, The switch panel changed to the rocker switches with a blank centre then had the screen wash was added that was previously next to the steering column. My 72 Gt was completely original when I first got it and had the rocker switches. My 71 is a bit of a mess, it definitely has the original body and it has the rocker switches as well but I couldn't be sure what has been messed with in the past as its had a hard life.

[JohninCM]

Have you already purchased the Clubman? Is it currently registered in California? If not you may run into some challenges getting it licensed for California since they were not sold here when new. If it needs plates get that sorted first and quickly so you may have a chance to get your money back if you run into problems.

And for what it's worth I agree with everyone else leave the front end as is. The Clubman's can look great when the right bits are added.

[JC T ONE]

EDIT. Uhhhh... did a post go missing? I thought JC posted something about the seats looking possibly Canadian? or am I losing it.



Yeah interesting JC, are you sure it has the square tunnel or has just the later gaiter been fitted to a remote floor, that floor looks a bit low to be rod change maybe.

Hi Ollie
I wanted to make a new post, so I deleted it.

Yes Clubby,s (and all other Mini model,s) didnt get imported to the US after 1969.
Hence why I asumed this was a Canadian ? but being RH drive I think its a private import.

The Pressnell book say the remote was deleted October 1972.
This makes sense, to why so many early MK III shells still have the blanking plate for the magic wand in place.

I found this early 1275GT in USA a few years ago, it has also been a full feature in Mini Mag

http://www.edenholmmotorgroup.com/web/u ... na/358070/


The Mini Mag article said it was a lowmilage / unrestored / etc etc car .

All its early features backs this up = dynamo - metal case airfilter - hydrolastic suspension -
hole for rubber grommet in LH inner wing ( BL dealer fitted wing aerial) etc etc
All can be seen in this 1969 press photo.

SOH956Hba.jpg

But it has a rod change why would you do that to a car thats done 900 miles ? (milage at the time of the article)
The milage was 3078 when it was for sale, the 5 was a mistake.

Its also missing its chromed "balls" (standard upto 1974ish) app.

Have you already purchased the Clubman? Is it currently registered in California? If not you may run into some challenges getting it licensed for California since they were not sold here when new. If it needs plates get that sorted first and quickly so you may have a chance to get your money back if you run into problems.

Hi John, yes as you can see is the W&P GT I posted above put on some MK II papers. luckely did the butcher, that hacked out the radiator scroud, not remove its FE & body number.

And for what it's worth I agree with everyone else leave the front end as is.
The Clubman's can look great when the right bits are added.

Sure can

[rich@minispares.com]

This is my other mini. Not really very original I'm afraid.

ohhhh

a local car


I own a mini that's a VAT ***S

[Ollie78]

Hi JC, ahhh... good to see I didn't imagine that, thought I was going mad.
Yes that's a very nice GT in the link and definitely an original early one, Its obviously had a ton of work (bodywork wise) being a WP anyway though hasn't it and I don't see any concrete evidence on the rod change square floor/exhaust tunnel, it clearly has a the later gaiter (and possibly gearbox) but the carpets are so thick who knows which pressing the floor plan is... or am I missing something obvious?
I have the Pressnal book too, I cant find where he says the rod change came in in October though, it says in the same sentence the 3 Millionth mini was produced in October 72 and later in the sentence goes on to say the rod change was brought in in December of that year so I would have thought it unlikely that any might have hit the road in 72 When Pressnal is talking specifically about the clubman development he goes on to say-
'Meanwhile the regular clubman and estate had continued, largely unchanged but for the various across the board improvements to the mini, the most important being the introduction in 1973 of the rod change gearbox.'
I know there are many oddities out there with minis I just haven't seen any unrestored factory original cars (72 or earlier) with a rod change, all of them I've seen are the round tunnel remote box type, maybe there are some prototypes out there
Here in the UK, as you probably know, up until recently the road tax exemption cut off was 72 or before, I think this has contributed to the number of re-shelled log book specials on the roads. I owned one once and was completely unaware of it being less well informed then.

By the way JC do you know what the large rubber grommets were for about half way up in the tops of the clubman inner wing both sides The GT in your link doesn't have them (which is right for its age). I have found they were introduced mid to late 71 but not sure why, any ideas

[JC T ONE]

Hi Ollie,


cant have you running in circles looking for posts that arent there

Regarding the Presnell book, that was my mistake, I misunderstood the "backward" way it was written.

Yes these 2 US cars are strange, lets just say that the gearbox on the W&P WAS changed?
(even thou its hard to belive with so little milage) where will a US based mechanic locate a rod change box, when all import, on Mini,s stopped 4 years earlier, and why is there 2 early cars with this box ?

Those seats in the 72 Clubby are also completely different to any I have seen before
The headlining also had me puzzled, it does look like its from a 60ies Mini.
It does have the rubber grommets in the inerwings, so that matches a 72.

The rod box and slimmer rear quarters with one peg handle also matches up.
I am very sure both were changed at the same time.

Would be great if we could get some dates from the wiper motor - fusebox - bootlid handle - etc, so we could pinpoint a more exact date on the car ?



Jens Christian

[yorkspv]

This is my other mini. Not really very original I'm afraid.

ohhhh

a local car


I own a mini that's a VAT ***S

Well I had it from down south, near Portsmouth about 6 years ago. Its had a few owners I can tell you! It's getting a little neglected now, but it's such fun to drive, a total contrast to to my other!

[2010rjd]

Heres a pic of an original interior.

Front seats.jpg

I have those exact seats in nice shape from a '69 Clubby I owned. I liked them well enough to consider using them on some other project.

[JC T ONE]

This is my other mini. Not really very original I'm afraid.

Its had a few owners I can tell you!
It's getting a little neglected now, but it's such fun to drive,
a total contrast to to my other!

Looks great

Is that group 5 arches ?

Jens Christian