when trying to get a new HTP for our mini, yesterday, I learned from the DMSB, the german motorsport authority, that following the new regulations http://www.fia.com/news/historic-motor- ... -decisions , Safety Device roll cages are not any longer possible. The standard one is not homologated with an intrusion bar whereas the multipoint has too many fixing points. I am still puzzled.
Please, has anyone an idea where to get a homologated and allowed bold in roll cage for a historic annex K competition mini?
when trying to get a new HTP for our mini, yesterday, I learned from the DMSB, the german motorsport authority, that following the new regulations http://www.fia.com/news/historic-motor- ... -decisions , Safety Device roll cages are not any longer possible. The standard one is not homologated with an intrusion bar whereas the multipoint has too many fixing points. I am still puzzled.
Please, has anyone an idea where to get a homologated and allowed bold in roll cage for a historic annex K competition mini?
Best regards
Have a look at Custom Cages T45 Historic Cage this should do the trick for you?
A very interesting question. Have you contacted Safety Devices? Looking at the latest FIA appendix K regs there are many diagrams of roll cage designs and I think bolt in cages are allowed. I am not a racer but would put safety first and think that welding is the stronger option. I checked the FIA website and came up with this. http://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/ ... 131029.pdf
Cliff
yes, I contacted them for I have both cages, the standard and the multipoint one. The problem is for example, they say, that a door bar not being mentioned in the homologation paper is an addition whereas the FIA is claiming it as a modification. The FIA will speak about during the next meeting in springtime. A bit late for us.
I have discovered from the Safety Devices website that a certificate of MSA/FIA approval can be obtained from the MSA (UK).
This is an extract from the 2013 MSA year book (UK).
"1.2.2. The ROPS (Cage) must not unduly impede Driver and Co-Driver access to the vehicle. Members may intrude into the interior space by passing through the dashboard, front side-trim, rear side-trim and rear seats, which may be folded down. ROPS must not extend beyond the front upper or rear suspension mounting points of the vehicle. Any modification to a homologated ROPS (other than fitment of doorbars) is prohibited. Tubes must not carry any fluids."
The Safety Devices cage design for the Classic Mini is approved by the MSA/FIA certificate 1056. There are 2 types of bolt in cage - 6 point and 18 point mounting.
If your cage(s) are not new and have prior approval I have read and believe that Homologation does not expire. I believe "Door bars" may be added to the bolt in cage with approved brackets/fixings without need for further homologation. The cage, if used for competition must have mount strengtheners welded to the body per instructions from Safety Devices. Both the FIA and MSA have a number of cage designs and fixings in their paperwork
Hope this helps.
Cliff
Thank you! But unfortunately not. There are very new regulations and the officials are claiming, that the homologation paper of the six point cage shows no door bars. The point was, adding such door bars would be a modification and each modification is not allowed. Concerning the multipoint cage they say, that there are too many fixing points. I told them, that it is not necessary to fix them all, but they do not accept. Maybe after the next meeting but not today.
I apologise but I think they are wrong.
5.13.6 General requirements for the construction of ROPS
(a) ROPS excluding FIA and ASN homologated structures, may have a maximum of 8 mounting points except when authorised elsewhere within these regulations, where a mounting point is the fixation of the ROPS with the body/chassis by welding, bolting or riveting. Any ROPS may be in contact with the bodyshell and this will not be regarded as a mounting point provided there is no fixation between ROPS and bodyshell.
(b) No bar may run laterally except at roof level or between vertical bars on either side of a driver’s or front passenger’s door opening. Bars across door openings must not exceed two on each side, and must not impede entry/ exit. Their fixing must not pre-tension the ROPS (a «bar» is a length of tube forming the ROPS between intersections with other tubes or between an intersection and a mounting point).
(c) No intersection or mounting point may incorporate any adjustable device to enable pre-tensioning of the ROPS.
(d) ROPS for cars having a backbone chassis, or which are of all fibreglass or aluminium tube construction, must have been submitted by an ASN to the FIA for approval.
(e) The bolts used should be of a sufficient minimum diameter, according to the number used. They must be of the highest possible quality (minimum grade 8.8).
Cliff
(f) One continuous length of tubing must be used for the main structure with smooth continuous bends and no evidence of crimping or wall failure. Extensions added above the main structure to increase the height are forbidden unless covered by an ASN or FIA roll cage certificate.
Astro wrote:Thank you! But unfortunately not. There are very new regulations and the officials are claiming, that the homologation paper of the six point cage shows no door bars. The point was, adding such door bars would be a modification and each modification is not allowed. Concerning the multipoint cage they say, that there are too many fixing points. I told them, that it is not necessary to fix them all, but they do not accept. Maybe after the next meeting but not today.
I am not understanding this! Seems to me that your best bet would be to bring the car to the. UK and get papers here as for what I know you would have no problem with the safety devices cage. However if you have the version with the forward facing strut from the harness rail that will be unacceptable so suggest that you un-bolt this whether or not you re-install later is I think up to you. Lots of cars are taking part in races in the UK including U2tc rounds with the Safety Devices bolt in cage so what's the problem, seems to me that we should be as safe as possible no matter how Appendix K interpreted? However if you want to get down to the minimum weight then I suggest that you need a weld in T45 cage. If you want to be competitive you need to be minimum weight
the forward facing braces are descriped as optional. Therefore I have remouved them. That is not the problem. Thank you. Some time in spring they may allow the cage. But this will be too late for the first runs and too late to try to defend the title.
Therefore my question was, if there is any other classic manufactor who offers a cage with doorbars and homologation papers.
