Good cam choice for a 1275 S

[NZmember]

I'd think about what gearbox and FD you're thinking of using and match the cam to that. No point in fittting a lairly 649 or 286 to a normal 4 synchro with 3.44 diff as that will be most annoying. Think of the end in mind and work back from that.
Don't fit a 649 or 286 type cam unless you are using a 3.9 or 4.1 diff.......

[Vegard]

Whilst discussing cam choice for my 1300 GT motor with my engine builder (i know, I'm getting lazy) I said I wanted to use a SW5. His reply was to go for a Piper BP 270 instead.
He said they are virtually identical with the same lift, dwell etc.

It seems there is plenty of choice available.

he was prob right... it is said they are very similar....i can only comment on use and observation as i am not an engineer !!! my piper 255 billet is a work of art.. the whole engine,gearbox twin h4,s,all the lightening and balancing that was done before i finally had it rolling roaded by peter baldwin speaks for itself.. 98bhp on tap in a fast useable road car....... it is very quick 0-50 and wheel spin is easily attained in 1st and 2cd because of the power avail.... a true testament to black-mamba on this forum a true pro in engine building etc for cars in the mini and super mighty,top hat racers also.....he also holds the 1/4+1/2 mile class sprint records in his 1293 mini race car in the brighton speed trials.......!!... i only wish i was that gifted to be able to do stuff like this myself !!! trusting in others and getting the right adv is the key...... foxy52

98 with a 255 camshaft is *cough cough* optimistic. I do however see where you've been, so it adds up.

[foxy52]

Whilst discussing cam choice for my 1300 GT motor with my engine builder (i know, I'm getting lazy) I said I wanted to use a SW5. His reply was to go for a Piper BP 270 instead.
He said they are virtually identical with the same lift, dwell etc.

It seems there is plenty of choice available.

he was prob right... it is said they are very similar....i can only comment on use and observation as i am not an engineer !!! my piper 255 billet is a work of art.. the whole engine,gearbox twin h4,s,all the lightening and balancing that was done before i finally had it rolling roaded by peter baldwin speaks for itself.. 98bhp on tap in a fast useable road car....... it is very quick 0-50 and wheel spin is easily attained in 1st and 2cd because of the power avail.... a true testament to black-mamba on this forum a true pro in engine building etc for cars in the mini and super mighty,top hat racers also.....he also holds the 1/4+1/2 mile class sprint records in his 1293 mini race car in the brighton speed trials.......!!... i only wish i was that gifted to be able to do stuff like this myself !!! trusting in others and getting the right adv is the key...... foxy52

98 with a 255 camshaft is *cough cough* optimistic. I do however see where you've been, so it adds up.

..it certainly does ...ill send you the whole engine spec if u like ?,i only took it to be tuned and rolling roaded at peter baldwins with a cert/test report re power output......fyi. 135bhp from an imp in 1970 with an engine under 1100 cc....!!! with a piper cam.. most impressive....

[Smiffy]

Why not post it on here ?

[foxy52]

Why not post it on here ?

...how many variables are there for owners to modify/tune up/get more power from their cars ?? the options would be endless...mine is an original cooper s mk 2 1275 engine bored and honed to 1330..twin 1 and a half inch h4,s with short stub ram pipes onto a janspeed inlet manifold..the cylinder head was radically..i mean radically modified.!! thats the key !!!.....re shaped valves and guides..hepolite 21253,s also machined flushed to top of deck heights...1.5 roller rockers,con rods..a top qual miglia spec crank reground an balanced steel flywheel..steel back plate with a competition clutch...orange diaphram,ultralight steel duplex steel billet and x drilled piper 255 cam+cam followers,..completely rebuilt engine/gearbox in 2007 with comp diff pin..centre oil pick up pipe,aldon yellow distributor,complete mk 2 stage 2 maniflow exhaust system with a thermotec wrap+engine baffle....the car also benefits from suspension with hi-lows fully adjustable with rose jointed tie bars and bottom ends...it grips the road like shi* !! corner weight checked with and a nice camber to the wheels...built,prepped an serviced by pat howe......rolling roaded,set up and tuned by mini -meister peter baldwin in jan 2012 and achieves 98bhp as i said before..and 5 years down the line its still running well... foxy52

[Smiffy]

...how many variables are there for owners to modify/tune up/get more power from their cars ?? the options would be endless...mine is an original cooper s mk 2 1275 engine bored and honed to 1330..twin 1 and a half inch h4,s with short stub ram pipes onto a janspeed inlet manifold..the cylinder head was radically..i mean radically modified.!! thats the key !!!.....re shaped valves and guides..hepolite 21253,s also machined flushed to top of deck heights...1.5 roller rockers,con rods..a top qual miglia spec crank reground an balanced steel flywheel..steel back plate with a competition clutch...orange diaphram,ultralight steel duplex steel billet and x drilled piper 255 cam+cam followers,..completely rebuilt engine/gearbox in 2007 with comp diff pin..centre oil pick up pipe,aldon yellow distributor,complete mk 2 stage 2 maniflow exhaust system with a thermotec wrap+engine baffle....the car also benefits from suspension with hi-lows fully adjustable with rose jointed tie bars and bottom ends...it grips the road like shi* !! corner weight checked with and a nice camber to the wheels...built,prepped an serviced by pat howe......rolling roaded,set up and tuned by mini -meister peter baldwin in jan 2012 and achieves 98bhp as i said before..and 5 years down the line its still running well... foxy52

About 70 -80bhp in the real world then and a 18 odd second quarter mile.........

[foxy52]

...how many variables are there for owners to modify/tune up/get more power from their cars ?? the options would be endless...mine is an original cooper s mk 2 1275 engine bored and honed to 1330..twin 1 and a half inch h4,s with short stub ram pipes onto a janspeed inlet manifold..the cylinder head was radically..i mean radically modified.!! thats the key !!!.....re shaped valves and guides..hepolite 21253,s also machined flushed to top of deck heights...1.5 roller rockers,con rods..a top qual miglia spec crank reground an balanced steel flywheel..steel back plate with a competition clutch...orange diaphram,ultralight steel duplex steel billet and x drilled piper 255 cam+cam followers,..completely rebuilt engine/gearbox in 2007 with comp diff pin..centre oil pick up pipe,aldon yellow distributor,complete mk 2 stage 2 maniflow exhaust system with a thermotec wrap+engine baffle....the car also benefits from suspension with hi-lows fully adjustable with rose jointed tie bars and bottom ends...it grips the road like shi* !! corner weight checked with and a nice camber to the wheels...built,prepped an serviced by pat howe......rolling roaded,set up and tuned by mini -meister peter baldwin in jan 2012 and achieves 98bhp as i said before..and 5 years down the line its still running well... foxy52

About 70 -80bhp in the real world then and a 18 odd second quarter mile.........

....soz smiffy..i still do not see the point or whatever it is u r trying to say ?..i think u entirely miss the point about owning a very fast small car... the fun in a quick s is driving from 1st thru to third and back ,up and down the gear box in high revs..thru tight lanes and roundabouts etc etc.... soooo quick !!!!!.....i am ecstatic to drive a 46 year old mini that goes like a banshee !!!...76 bhp on tap would have been avail when these mk 2,s were new.. if u can afford to or build yr own be it whatever spec..enjoy yr mini ??...i have driven minis since the late 60,s...being 60 + years old now...it certainly puts a smile on my face,..funnily enough i have been out for a drive in it today,..the first day here in the east we have had a sunny morning and now the snows gone and the roads are dry and as my car has been on trickle charge for 3 weeks due the excessive cold,.. so new champion plugs in this morning ...and great ! she fired first time .. a nice blast to cromer and back with just under 100 bhp under my foot mmm !!! .....happy days ...i hope u enjoy yr mini as much as i do ??foxy52

[Smiffy]

I do indeed enjoy driving mine, even though I only have 97 bananas..........thanks and glad you enjoy yours as well.

[foxy52]

I do indeed enjoy driving mine, even though I only have 97 bananas..........thanks and glad you enjoy yours as well.

lol.. ..smiffy..pat and the boys have jus rung me from the pub !!! having a good chuckle.. if u have a 649 cam whats the spec of the engine ??.. something must be awry ??... some silly things get said on this forum.. i remember a few weeks back the comment i made about using a top quality mobil 10/40 semi synth.. as opposed to those still using 20/50 on ostensibly rebuilt engines,gear boxes with higher grade cams/cranks and modified heads.. 1071s from the forum said baulk rings would suffer..??!! i can only tell u that 3 of the top cars on the miglia scene that have pat howe built engines have been running comps for 3 + years very successfully with no problems at all ... there u go ?!!... happy mini-ing foxy52..and black-mamba.. all time class record holder in his 1293 race car for the 1/4 and 1/2 mile sprint at the brighton speed trials ..what an engine !!!.....

[Smiffy]

lol.. ..smiffy..pat and the boys have jus rung me from the pub !!! having a good chuckle.. if u have a 649 cam whats the spec of the engine ??.. something must be awry ??... some silly things get said on this forum.. i remember a few weeks back the comment i made about using a top quality mobil 10/40 semi synth.. as opposed to those still using 20/50 on ostensibly rebuilt engines,gear boxes with higher grade cams/cranks and modified heads.. 1071s from the forum said baulk rings would suffer..??!! i can only tell u that 3 of the top cars on the miglia scene that have pat howe built engines have been running comps for 3 + years very successfully with no problems at all ... there u go ?!!... happy mini-ing foxy52..and black-mamba.. all time class record holder in his 1293 race car for the 1/4 and 1/2 mile sprint at the brighton speed trials ..what an engine !!!.....

basically it's it's a 1380 built by me back in '93, with the 649 operated by titan 1.5:1 full roller rockers, head has 36x31 valves, and it runs on a 45 weber. With a fully worked bottom end and it does the quarter mile in 15.5 sec's, at york raceway.............

[foxy52]

lol.. ..smiffy..pat and the boys have jus rung me from the pub !!! having a good chuckle.. if u have a 649 cam whats the spec of the engine ??.. something must be awry ??... some silly things get said on this forum.. i remember a few weeks back the comment i made about using a top quality mobil 10/40 semi synth.. as opposed to those still using 20/50 on ostensibly rebuilt engines,gear boxes with higher grade cams/cranks and modified heads.. 1071s from the forum said baulk rings would suffer..??!! i can only tell u that 3 of the top cars on the miglia scene that have pat howe built engines have been running comps for 3 + years very successfully with no problems at all ... there u go ?!!... happy mini-ing foxy52..and black-mamba.. all time class record holder in his 1293 race car for the 1/4 and 1/2 mile sprint at the brighton speed trials ..what an engine !!!.....

basically it's it's a 1380 built by me back in '93, with the 649 operated by titan 1.5:1 full roller rockers, head has 36x31 valves, and it runs on a 45 weber. With a fully worked bottom end and it does the quarter mile in 15.5 sec's, at york raceway.............

....just a tad slower than patrick then in his fantastic 1293 ??!! ... in point of fact just under 2 seconds slower !!!!. ..with or without his split webbers ...not a bad effort though ...i did 13+ in my webber alpha brm golf gti 16v mk 2 in 1990 at crowthorne...... u make me chuckle ,.. soz bananas ..err smiffy.. my **** bigger than sorry thats it !!! i cant do it for laughing soz.. rgds foxy52

[Smiffy]

....just a tad slower than patrick then in his fantastic 1293 ??!! ... in point of fact just under 2 seconds slower !!!!. ..with or without his split webbers ...not a bad effort though ... u make me chuckle ,.. soz bananas ..err smiffy.. rgds foxy52

maybe but quite a bit faster than yours, actually thinking about yours, with the 255 cam. That is a towing cam after all, iirc thats how piper used to describe it in the eighties. So probably slower than a standard MG metro, the unleaded example of course..........

[foxy52]

....just a tad slower than patrick then in his fantastic 1293 ??!! ... in point of fact just under 2 seconds slower !!!!. ..with or without his split webbers ...not a bad effort though ... u make me chuckle ,.. soz bananas ..err smiffy.. rgds foxy52

maybe but quite a bit faster than yours, actually thinking about yours, with the 255 cam. That is a towing cam after all, iirc thats how piper used to describe it in the eighties. So probably slower than a standard MG metro, the unleaded example of course..........

oh smiffy come on now ??!!.. ....whats one bhp between freinds ??!!...dont be miffed that i have 98bhp.. after al the cylinder head is a work of art never mind the rest of it ......15.5 doesnt even come close does it ?!..nothing there to brag about my **** bigger syndrome again.. .. i doubt u could catch my car in a sprint !!??and mines just a fast sensible car for road not track use ..lumpy cams and webbers throbbing gulping loadsa fuel are not for me.. i travel up and down east anglia and down to stanstead and sussex in a smooth car to drive ..... getting back to pats beast of a 1293,s its terminal velocity equates to roughly having done the 0-60 in 5.3secs !!!...thats up there with a lotus elise for sprinting !!....its the fastest mini i have ever watched anywhere ,.. i know there must be faster but not many !!!!.....take a look at the records over the last 3 decades at the brighton speed trials..they are freely avail and the under 1300 cc class is a fascinating one ... ps dont bother entering it though ......soz i reckon u would be 4th ??!!

[guru_1071]

1071s from the forum said baulk rings would suffer..??!! i can only tell u that 3 of the top cars on the miglia scene that have pat howe built engines have been running comps for 3 + years very successfully with no problems at all ... there u go ?!!...

as miglias run dog boxes, i doubt that they will have problems with bulk ring wear........

i guess my expirences of 7 years of spannering for a mighty mini team, and years of dealing with people racing cars stand for nothing in a discussion about thin oils and the affect it has on gearbox wear.....

[Smiffy]

oh smiffy come on now ??!!.. ....whats one bhp between freinds ??!!...dont be miffed that i have 98bhp.. after al the cylinder head is a work of art never mind the rest of it ......15.5 doesnt even come close does it ?!..nothing there to brag about my **** bigger syndrome again.. .. i doubt u could catch my car in a sprint !!??and mines just a fast sensible car for road not track use ..lumpy cams and webbers throbbing gulping loadsa fuel are not for me.. i travel up and down east anglia and down to stanstead and sussex in a smooth car to drive ..... getting back to pats beast of a 1293,s its terminal velocity equates to roughly having done the 0-60 in 5.3secs !!!...thats up there with a lotus elise for sprinting !!....its the fastest mini i have ever watched anywhere ,.. i know there must be faster but not many !!!!.....take a look at the records over the last 3 decades at the brighton speed trials..they are freely avail and the under 1300 cc class is a fascinating one ... ps dont bother entering it though ......soz i reckon u would be 4th ??!!

reminds my youth, remember Jackanory........

[foxy52]

oh smiffy come on now ??!!.. ....whats one bhp between freinds ??!!...dont be miffed that i have 98bhp.. after al the cylinder head is a work of art never mind the rest of it ......15.5 doesnt even come close does it ?!..nothing there to brag about my **** bigger syndrome again.. .. i doubt u could catch my car in a sprint !!??and mines just a fast sensible car for road not track use ..lumpy cams and webbers throbbing gulping loadsa fuel are not for me.. i travel up and down east anglia and down to stanstead and sussex in a smooth car to drive ..... getting back to pats beast of a 1293,s its terminal velocity equates to roughly having done the 0-60 in 5.3secs !!!...thats up there with a lotus elise for sprinting !!....its the fastest mini i have ever watched anywhere ,.. i know there must be faster but not many !!!!.....take a look at the records over the last 3 decades at the brighton speed trials..they are freely avail and the under 1300 cc class is a fascinating one ... ps dont bother entering it though ......soz i reckon u would be 4th ??!!

reminds my youth, remember Jackanory........

...no ..i was working when u were in the infants i would imagine.. ?!

[foxy52]

1071s from the forum said baulk rings would suffer..??!! i can only tell u that 3 of the top cars on the miglia scene that have pat howe built engines have been running comps for 3 + years very successfully with no problems at all ... there u go ?!!...

as miglias run dog boxes, i doubt that they will have problems with bulk ring wear........

i guess my expirences of 7 years of spannering for a mighty mini team, and years of dealing with people racing cars stand for nothing in a discussion about thin oils and the affect it has on gearbox wear.....

my comment based on 20/50 as opposed to a far superior 10/40 was purely aimed at a thread concerning the pros and cons of using quality semi synth modern products be it on yr everyday classic or a mighty ,super mighty mini race car.. i didnt bring up the question of baulk ring wear/gearbox probs..u did ?!.. i do not wish to argue with u and do not doubt yr limited experience spannering..as you put it...nor do i doubt yr competence whatsoever tinkering with race cars... but if u had the decades and decades of experience of others i listen to and have used their services building fabulous road/race engines,highly modified work on cylinder heads and a standard of engineering expertise so few can aspire to i would err on the side of their superior knowledge/skills ??...

[foxy52]

....so guys .. the thread was whats a good cam ??... i say my piper 255 works well,..but its the sum of all the parts under my bonnet that makes it a quick ,fast road classic s........as far as oil is concerned we pays our money and makes our choice...? all forum members can post their experiences to help others less informed.. its not the spanish inquisition is it ??... tooo many know alls with differing opinions as ever !!!....its a lively forum and all views/opinions should be considered,..i feel sorry if anyone has been offended dunno why though ???? ......so lighten up chaps eh ????...... i shall zziip it now...nothing further to say its been done to death.....respectfully foxy52....

[guru_1071]

i didnt bring up the question of baulk ring wear/gearbox probs..u did ?!..

foxy

i cut and pased your comment above direct from your thread above and was only correcting your claim that i was incorrect that thin oil affects the wear of baulk rings because of your exprience of miglias..... i do not see how your mate building a couple of dog box using miglias proves that 10/40 increases the life of a gearbox over using 20/50 oil


if you have expirence of helical boxes been used hard with 10/40 and no baulk/syncro wear, then please tell me about it.

it is a constant and unsolvable issue in mighty minis, and none of the engine builders who build boxes for the series can get a longer life out of a gearbox when using a thin oil.

i give up, i spend my life sorting out warrenty issues because people insist on running piss thin oil and fully synthetic oil on the advice of 'experts' and am still wrong........

im not getting involved anymore

[Smiffy]

..no ..i was working when u were in the infants i would imagine.. ?!

Here we go with the age thing again, sounds like someone else from somewhere else...........Doesn't matter that some of us have tried just about every cam on the market, they know it all. After all some of these people have even had a engine built for them a rebored to first oversize 1275, with a cam that most would think a waste of money. Put a head on thats a work of art with multi angle seats and got better results than even vizard himself............