Has the electric car bubble burst?

[Peter Laidler]

When I see fully loaded Eddie Stobart electric/battery lorry thundering up the M6 or along the M4 I'll come to my senses and accept that Electricity - or something else - has won the day.

[Rolandino]

But are there batteries In a vibrator? How long do they last? Can you recharge it? What's the point of having a battery driven car when you can own a vibrator?

[gs.davies]

I drove the Electric Mini SE last year before the wife's Cooper S PCP deal expired. It went like a rocket, a incredible wave of silent accelerative torque that didn't stop propelling the car forward until it maxed out. It really was something else. We were pretty convinced that it was the way to go, that was until we sat down and crunched numbers..

For a monthly outlay probably almost £100 over the current 5 door Cooper S we could have the 3 door Cooper SE, losing the rear doors isn't ideal for the use my wife puts it to, but the range would be more than adequate to cover her daily routine. But all added up, with the increased leasing costs, we'd about break even compared to sticking a few gallons in the ICE Cooper S. And that didn't move us. The prices are just laughable. The dealer's insistence that we'd 'save money on petrol' was easily countered with the fact that the change would go straight to a finance company.. We simply renewed the S for another few years. Apart from insisting it wants a set of rear pads, there's nothing wrong with it and it's great fun to drive it hard. I can see us keeping it for quite some time, the way things are going economically.

Is electric the way forward? Yes, probably, but until prices can compete with ICE vehicles I can't see it. When it does happen, it'll snowball though.

I don't think any of the big OEMs are really looking at anything else either; synthetic fuels, hydrogen etc, all probably better solutions, but if there's no market big enough then I can't see it getting a foothold.

Enjoy ICE while you can.

[gs.davies]

But are there batteries In a vibrator? How long do they last? Can you recharge it? What's the point of having a battery driven car when you can own a vibrator?

Without the sound of tens of thousands of small explosions happening every minute exiting their gases out of a long steel pipe , you've got to get your kicks somehow...

[mab01uk]

Last time I drove from Surrey to the South of France, Mediterranean coast I only had to refuel my BWW 320D once on the approx. 850 mile journey...with a range of 550-600 miles fairly easily achieved by my diesel BMW on the French Autoroutes. Stopping only once to refuel was a major advantage, as anyone who has driven that route, especially in the summer holiday season, will know the queues for petrol/diesel fuel at the service areas can be very long at peak times and add to the overall journey time. Imagine what the queues would be like if you had to wait for all those cars to be re-charged even on fast chargers and had to do that every 200 miles or so....

[rolesyboy]

Ok but in reality how often do you go to the South of France?? I can’t say I would consider doing that journey on one fuel stop as a major triumph. It’s a small convenience in the scheme of things. For most drivers 90% of your annual mileage won’t be driving to the South of France . It would be made up of lots of short journeys with occasional longer journeys.
on those occasions my Tesla does 300-350 miles on a full charge. Call it 300 miles. So I have to stop at a fast charger twice, for which the car gives me a live status update on location and availability of a charging point should I need it. A 300 mile journey is going to take 4-5 hours at best. Bugger trying to do that in one hit. I will take a leg stretch, grab a coffee and some lunch and enjoy the journey cos I I’m on holiday.
It’s a circular debate and this one turns in to a big time sink but I do think there is far more merit to EVs than people realise.

[111Robin]

I'll wait to see how they perform after ten years/100k miles. If they are a throw away device after half that due to battery degradation then I remain unconvinced. I will never be in the market for a new car of any type, I run an "old banger" as my daily as do thousands of others out of economic necessity. I have no idea how long the batteries will last, I haven't done any research,, but it's far too early to say based on consumer evidence. I'll watch with interest as I continue to flog my old diesel banger to death.

[MiNiKiN]

I'll wait to see how they perform after ten years/100k miles. If they are a throw away device after half that due to battery degradation then I remain unconvinced. I will never be in the market for a new car of any type, I run an "old banger" as my daily as do thousands of others out of economic necessity. I have no idea how long the batteries will last, I haven't done any research,, but it's far too early to say based on consumer evidence. I'll watch with interest as I continue to flog my old diesel banger to death.

Wait no longer.
An article from German Bild tabloid - the equivalent to "the Sun" or so. This write up has also appeared elsewhere, but I thought I post the trnaslated article from EV-hater "Bild":
<<Long-distance record in the Model S electric car
Unbelievable: This Tesla drove one million kilometres

By: Holger Karkheck
28.11.2019 - 20:28 Uhr

That's what you call range: Hansjörg Freiherr von Gemmingen-Hornberg (56) today completed the one million kilometre mark in his Tesla Model S.

His red electric sedan has driven the equivalent of 25 times around the world in just five years. A world record!

"I drive about 600 kilometres a day," says the trained farmer. "I used to sit on the tractor all day, it was no different then." In the meantime, Freiherr von Gemmingen-Hornberg lives near Karlsruhe as a private citizen who made his fortune partly with foreign exchange trading.

Now he has time. His longest journey: to the North Cape, a total of 14,000 kilometres in 14 days. The frequent e-driver bought the Model S as a demonstration vehicle. One year old, 30 000 kilometres on the digital speedometer. "I paid just under 90 000 euros." That was in 2014.

He gets his free electricity from Tesla

Since then, Freiherr von Gemmingen-Hornberg has had only low operating costs. "I get electricity for free from Tesla. It also costs nothing in the hotels where I stay."

Tesla also gives an eight-year warranty. "With no kilometre limit," the driver emphasises. "Maybe they'll give me another new motor." In the meantime, he has already had his fourth motor, all of them replaced under warranty.
The current battery, the second in the car, has covered 470,000 kilometres and has lost only 20 per cent of its original capacity. The range is currently still around 300 kilometres. And consumption? 16.6 kilowatt hours, says the owner. But you can't say that exactly - there is only data for the last 330,000 kilometres ...

Brakes are hardly ever used

"All in all, I have paid 13 000 euros for repairs." Wear and tear is also within limits. Once, he had not been serviced for 300,000 kilometres. Otherwise: new tyres every 50,000 kilometres, new brakes every 400,000 kilometres. "In 99 per cent of the cases, I drive with recuperation and don't have to brake at all."

His next goal is now one million miles (i.e. 1.65 million kilometres). "An intermediate goal," says the baron. "I drive the Tesla as gently as possible, rarely over 120 km/h. After all, I want it to last a long time."

Why is he doing all this? He wants to create more understanding for alternative drives. "The electric car is a piece in the mosaic; much more needs to happen.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)>>

[111Robin]

"Tesla also gives an eight-year warranty. "With no kilometre limit," the driver emphasises. "Maybe they'll give me another new motor." In the meantime, he has already had his fourth motor, all of them replaced under warranty.

That's hardly encouraging. I doubt all manufacturers will cover motor replacement so willingly once such failures become more commonplace. I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't a publicity stunt by Tesla, maybe they forgot to tell him not to say anything about the four replacement motors ?.

Also, not servicing a car for 300,000k isn't exactly a good thing, especially with the reduced use of the brakes. Seized calipers, corroded discs, alloy wheels stuck on the hubs etc., all the things you see nowadays with cars that aren't properly serviced. Basically encouraging people not to look after their car, brilliant advice. You won't know until you need to do an emergency stop, then it's too late. But it's ok, you're saving the planet

[Glacier white]

Indeed, for some people like the case of the aformentioned gentleman from Germany, his Tesla sounds ideal.
Having a few hundrend thousand to spare, and plenty of time to kill, it's not a problem to clock up the miles, at your leisure, i must add.

For anyone else that still must be somewhat more productive, a range of 300 Km and speeds up to 120 Km/h sound rather inadequate, to put it politely.
Just to be clear, i am not against this technology in general, but truth to be told, it's not for everyone. I am sure it is ideal for short commuting, school runs, shopping, etc, if you can charge it at home overnight, but if you start adding other uses, you'll find it becomes an expensive compromise.

It's a totally different thing having to cover 500+ Km in a day with a half an hour stop to stretch your legs and maybe have a coffee, from covering the same distance and trying to find a place to stop where you can actually charge your car in a reasonable time. I mean, whoever is using his car for longish bussiness trips, having to press on and all that, would laugh at the restrictions EVs are having at the moment.