It’s looking like 2030 for E-day

General Chat with an emphasis on BMC Minis & Other iconic cars of the 1960's. Includes information on MK1 Action days.
Post Reply
User avatar
mab01uk
Posts: 4664
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 7:08 pm
Location: S.E. England

Re: It’s looking like 2030 for E-day

Post by mab01uk »

Interesting to read this comparison below of the speed of the transition from horses to cars as the main means of transport in the early 1900s....

The EV Transition Could Mirror The Horse To Model T Transition
"Analysis of past technological shifts indicates that, once a certain threshold is reached, the transition could take place at surprising speed. It is surprising how fast cars replaced horses as the main means of transport in the early 1900s. It happened in only 10 to 15 years in spite of many hurdles much higher than the barriers to adopting electric vehicles are today. In 1910 there were few paved roads and petrol was hard to find — today’s infrastructure of refineries and petrol stations didn’t exist. A decade later things looked quite different, governments and the oil industry were investing huge sums in roads and other infrastructure. In 1921 the Ford Model T was selling a million units a year. By 1925 annual sales were approaching two million. Making the switch to an electric car is much simpler than swapping the bag of oats for the fuel pump was a century ago. Furthermore, there are several technological and geopolitical trends that are combining to turbocharge the gathering electromobility revolution. One is the rise of China which is struggling to deal with choking air pollution and has global ambitions for its auto industry. Another is the advent of vehicle autonomy, which some believe will make transportation so cheap that few will want to own their own vehicles anymore. The shift will have little to do with climate change or government regulations — it will be a simple matter of cost and convenience."
https://cleantechnica.com/2017/10/07/ev ... ransition/
User avatar
MiNiKiN
Posts: 138
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2017 3:15 pm
Location: Graz/Austria // NN1 4ST previously

Re: It’s looking like 2030 for E-day

Post by MiNiKiN »

Hi John, I added my thoughts, facts and questions to your statements below.
JohnA wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:06 pm
MiNiKiN wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 11:46 am Does the grid currently go down when all at the same time switch on their cookers at noon or after work?
That doesn't happen because people don't have the skills to use them - They call for a takeaway
The food bank in Carlisle is complaining they can't give some food away because people don't know how to cook it
maybe in UK nowadays [despite Jamie Oliver ;) ], here on the Mid EU mainland we cook, and the lights have yet not gone out or the grid broken - in actual fact there is plenty of studies and statements from energy suppliers where they state to cope with increasing demand. Secondly I am sure measures will be taken to spread the load over the day (buffers along with variing tariffs)
Fun fact, or actually not at all: No one seems to ask how much energy currently goes into petrol production (i.e. oil recovery, transport and refining into fuel. It is an ginormous amount


I suppose these electric cars will be brought from the Far East on the massive ships that pollute the planet more
with one voyage than all the cars in the U.K. does in a year
All the petrol and diesel cars come from the UK of course and have never been shipped from somewhere ;) ;) :?
And yes the ships pollute about as much as the cars - so buy less stuff and keep longer, as most has lots of embodied energy in it. I hope you are being a good anti-consumerism role model - yes, if I take into account keeping old cars alive


I wonder how far an electric ship could travel before it needs to call in for a few months to car it's battery :lol:
The 4 year old Nissan Note tested by Top Gear had a range of 23 miles, not good for a trade in :lol:
You lough, suppose above makes you chuckle as you realise the nonsense yourself. 310kmiles Tesla battery had still 86% capacity. Top gear (as much as I liked them, except Clarkson) are just EV bashing because they are stooges of the petro-chemical industry as such

How are these batteries going to be disposed of ?
They are not disposed of, they are used for stationary battery packs, etc. in their after-car-life. Afterwards, i.e. after 15-20 years of life they are recycled and materials go back into the manufacturing process.

I've been told the sourcing of materials for the manufacture these batteries isn't very eco friendly
You have been told rightly, often primary production is neither eco-friendly nor very social. That needs to and is already addressed by the manufacturers of batteries and EV's.
On the other hand, the rare earth Lithium isn't rare at all and problematic COBALT: only 20% of its current production goes into car-batteries, the rest is used for batteries in mobile devices (phone, laptop, ...), refining oil[!] and steel production. Have you ever moaned about eco-frienlyness of the latter 3 product groups?


I have a friend who runs his Allegro on LPG maybe that's an alternative
I'll be 82 in 2030 so it won't will be a problem for me :D
Glad I've been fortunate enough to have lived at a good time - I agree and say the same about me, aged 50 :D but as Bob Dylan sings "The Times They Are A-Changin"
EVs are one step towards a change in attidude where people have to realise that current individual transport (i.e. where everyone has his/her own car) is a thing from the past. You simply cannot motorise all the population in the world. Too less resources is just one of many reasons..
BTW: Sorry for my environmentalist and EV-expert me popping up - take care!
I keep my Heligan pineapple jam in Mk1 glass washer bottles :mrgreen:
User avatar
Andrew1967
Posts: 5931
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 6:35 pm
Location: Usually in my garage on the east coast of Norfolk, UK

Re: It’s looking like 2030 for E-day

Post by Andrew1967 »

Looks like I'll have buy an early retirement present for myself now, rather than in 2035 :?

Tell people something for long enough and eventually they'll believe it, time will prove whether its right or not ...
User avatar
Exminiman
Posts: 972
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2017 8:59 am
Location: Berkshire UK

Re: It’s looking like 2030 for E-day

Post by Exminiman »

Does look like the writing is on the wall, can see that its very likely that fuel will get more expensive, as requirement drops, but standing costs stay the same.....unless, maybe the government decides to take less tax on fuel :mrgreen:
52 Festive Road, London.
https://youtu.be/3QQFJqOmh5I
User avatar
mab01uk
Posts: 4664
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 7:08 pm
Location: S.E. England

Re: It’s looking like 2030 for E-day

Post by mab01uk »

Hybrids are a stop gap and the worst of all worlds – ICE engine, gearbox, electric motor & batteries all adding weight & complexity, but are going to be a popular choice for some time while range remains the issue with pure electric and until there is more and faster charging infrastructure.

EV running costs that are not always considered:-
What Car? say "Some car manufacturers offer the option of leasing the car’s batteries rather than buying them to keep the price of their EVs down. If the battery is leased and its capacity drops below 75% of its original rate, it will be replaced for free. Running costs that are not always considered for a new EV vary depending on how many miles the car is going to do. A driver doing 6000 miles a year in a new Renault Zoe ZE 40 will pay approx £59 a month to lease the batteries; this rises to £99 a month for a car doing 10,500 miles a year. Excess mileage is charged at 8p per mile, and the lease periods are generally three years, the same as most PCP new car buying deals. For a used EV, the majority of cars are likely to have leased batteries. Rather than leasing the batteries on a second-hand purchase, it’s possible to buy the battery outright with the car – we’ve seen reports of people buying four-year-old cars and paying around £3500 extra to buy the battery, (but if/when it fails......) "The lifespan of the battery pack depends on how much it’s charged. You can extend the life of the batteries by only charging them up to 80% and trying not to let them drop below 50% too often."

However it might be worth parking your valuable ICE Mini a good distance away from the EV parking bays... :lol:
China - Electric vehicle fire while charging.....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2F9HKZ5VzA
User avatar
miniminor
Posts: 552
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:49 pm
Location: Upside down behind the TV

Re: It’s looking like 2030 for E-day

Post by miniminor »

Im going to have to scratch the V8 itch sooner than later then..... :lol:
"Get the wheels in line, Get the wheels in line with it! ..... and then slam your brakes on or we'll be in the cabin ! "

1963 Morris Mini Minor Superdeluxe
2014 Freelander 2 SD4
User avatar
mk1coopers
Posts: 1714
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 2:14 pm

Re: It’s looking like 2030 for E-day

Post by mk1coopers »

I'll be happy to have a EV for the local trips, as long as I can still use the Mini's (which by now with their lower use have a minimal impact) plus something very silly and V8'e for fun, I'm surprised there has not been a mass release of data by some of the (cough Greta) usual suspects to show how much the planets emissions have dropped during lockdown and how it's had such a great impact in a short time because it's been a perfect situation to prove the science with the reduction in car use, which always seems to get the 'blame' :roll:, perhaps the improvements have not been as good as they predicted :?:
hanlminiman
Posts: 561
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 3:12 pm
Location: Still in a Car Home in North Cotswolds, close to Stratford upon Avon UK

Re: It’s looking like 2030 for E-day

Post by hanlminiman »

Believe it or not I can still get 4 star fuel locally; for a price! But then, how much is "super unleaded?" and how many miles do I travel on my limited mileage insurance policy each year? I still have electricity supplied by aerial wires across my garden with local residents charging their mobility vehicles at home. The local hotels have charging points but not the local authority; no public car parks! Just thinking out loud. Oh yes, the hotels are closed. But then I'm in the "vulnerable age group." So what do I know?
User avatar
mab01uk
Posts: 4664
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 7:08 pm
Location: S.E. England

Re: It’s looking like 2030 for E-day

Post by mab01uk »

mk1coopers wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:03 pm I'm surprised there has not been a mass release of data by some of the (cough Greta) usual suspects to show how much the planets emissions have dropped during lockdown and how it's had such a great impact in a short time because it's been a perfect situation to prove the science with the reduction in car use, which always seems to get the 'blame' :roll:, perhaps the improvements have not been as good as they predicted :?:
I was thinking the same, as when aircraft were grounded after the 9/11 attack, soon after on TV there was a in depth scientific documentary which showed how much the atmosphere, etc had improved during the short period without the effects of aircraft pollution. With the much longer lockdown of the aircraft and travel industry you would think there would be much bigger improvements this time to promote the cause for change?
User avatar
MiNiKiN
Posts: 138
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2017 3:15 pm
Location: Graz/Austria // NN1 4ST previously

Re: It’s looking like 2030 for E-day

Post by MiNiKiN »

We did have reports of reduced pollution during lock-down - although you had to look for these, because from C-Day (i.e. when Covid arrived) there weren't any other newsthan Covid19 and the important environmental actions, news and protest literally disappeared in the publics agenda overnight.
I keep my Heligan pineapple jam in Mk1 glass washer bottles :mrgreen:
Post Reply