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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:40 pm 
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Location: Oop North where it's dark & cold nearly all the time.
For those of you like me who have children who you are trying to encourage into our wonderful hobby, no doubt you have come across the nightmare that is insurance.

Just a quick heads up to say that there is light at the end of the tunnel.

12 months after passing his test I have managed to get Adam insured on a multi vehicle policy which includes his 79 Clubman Estate, the Downton 1300 Mk2 & the Moke for just a whisker over £1,000 for the next 12 months.

OK, I know it's still very expensive, but it is almost 1/3 of what they wanted for his Clubman alone last year. This policy is with Footman James who were actually very helpful & were the only people who would do a "Father / Son policy" at what I considered to be a reasonable price.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:08 pm 
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That's good, Mark. There's hope for some of us in a second life.


Changing the subject somewhat, I had heard that one of the magazines had commissioned a 'pros and cons' review of the classic car insurance companies, but think it was never published. Has anyone heard of it?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:13 pm 
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Nice :) that was a good "cut"

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:26 pm 
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I remember when I was trying hard to get my 17 year old son insured as a learner driver with me as principal driver/owner (insured risk) in 1995/1996 on a 1981 Mini City that the Insurers could not comprehend that the risk was lower as he would be accompanied at all times until he passed his test. My son learned the art of early braking with all round drum brakes very early!
I suggest it is very important that our children are added to our policies as most of us are getting older and our valuable cars (agreed value) might not be insured in the event of our death. Sorry but it worries me as my wife does not drive!
My children are much older now!
Cliff
ps My problem was that it was my first car as I had a company car.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:47 pm 
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Location: Coastal VA USA
I feel your pain, I have a 16 and a 17 year old, one just now driving and one with a learners permit. It has been explained to me that I have two high risk drivers on my policy. My agent didn't even want to talk about Alex driving the mini. He suggested I buy him a older Ford F 150 P/U truck.

As a kid I tended to get into a little trouble driving. When insurance reached $1500. a month I opted for uninsured plates. I was a college student with a $300. 850 mini. Paying and extra $200. for plates and rolling the dice worked for me. Having a couple of DWI tickets didn't help. Having been in AA and sober for the last 42 years has brought insurance down. In fact I recently made an improper turn and got pulled. When he came back he said, your record is so clean I'm going to ask you not to do that again and send you on your way.

As for pulling our kids into the hobby, some will and some won't. Alex could have any of the mini projects I have on hand if he wanted. Maybe I should take his mother's 911 out of storage. She was getting to many tickets and had to park it. Steve (CTR)


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 9:10 am 
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Steve, There are a couple of things in your post that I have to ask you about / comment on.

1) You said - "He suggested I buy him a older Ford F 150 P/U truck" - That is so funny, what Adam really wants is a BIG US pickup, he could use it for his work as an Arborist (Lumberjack). However, to get one of those insured in the UK would be over £10,000 a year! Most companies simply wouldn't touch him.

2) You said "When insurance reached $1500. a month I opted for uninsured plates" Can you drive uninsured in the States? The idea is absolutely unthinkable here!! How does that work?

It is interesting how different things are viewed differently around the world isn't it.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 1:38 am 
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Location: Coastal VA USA
Yes, don't you love it. I had planned on son Alex driving a mini just like I did. My insurance man ( this is the fourth one I have had in 40 years with the same company ) ask me not to allow him to use the mini as his primary transportation. A full size sedan or a Ford pick up top his list. With my driving record under 25 I decided I needed a big block Corvette and ask my insurance man and his reply was we may be able to cover you at $1500. a month. I was planning to make payments and they won't loan the money without insurance. Back then uninsured motorist fee was $200. The money goes into a statewide fund to help those damaged by uninsured drivers. Just for fun I ask if they still have that when getting plates for Alex's Honda Civic coupe. Yes they do and the cost is now $500. My lawyer was hit in his R 8 Audi by three guys in a old Chevy P/U who were drunk, no license, no speak English, no home address or insurance. You ask how this works and it seems not very well for the victim. All of this was in Virginia USA I know little about other states. Steve (CTR)


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 4:18 am 
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Location: Durham, NC USA
mk1 wrote:
Can you drive uninsured in the States? The idea is absolutely unthinkable here!! How does that work?


Insurance laws are different from state to state. I cannot speak for VA where Steve is. I live just south of there in NC and we must have insurance. You can gamble and only carry the state required minimum liability coverage or add collision and comprehensive coverage to protect your car in the event you cause an accident and/or from incidental damage. Some states like NC also require the insurance company to add a part of the policy described as "uninsured motorist coverage" to protect you in the event someone without insurance causes damage to your vehicle. In addition to some states that may not require insurance, there are always illegal drivers like those with suspended licenses.

Learner driver insurance is also different from state to state. Here in NC a learner driver has to be on their permit for about 18 months. During that time they are not allowed to drive without a licensed driver in the car with them. They also have to log a certain number of daylight and "after dark" driving hours before they get their restricted license. During that period, the learner is covered under the parent's insurance WITHOUT CHARGE. NC's argument is that the learner/child is under the watchful eye of the parent... as if the parent were driving.

We just sold our Spitfire this week. I only had liability on it and that added $200 a year to our policy. It was our older son's car through high school and college. We were not accessed any surcharge for a young driver in an older car. That came as a bit of a surprise to us.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:11 am 
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Apparently in France since November 2015 children as young as 14 can drive VSPs. They're deemed to be safer than a scooter.....a VSP a voiture sans permis - a small two-seater car that anyone aged 14 or over can take out on the road with as little as four hours' experience behind the wheel. Top speed is 45km per hour (28mph).

Image
A VSP tucked between an old-style Mini and a Smart car

The little car you can drive in France without a licence
"Youngsters have to take a theoretical exam in the French highway code (this is waived entirely if you were born before the law was last changed in 1988) and drive accompanied for a minimum of four hours, but no-one has to sit any kind of practical test to frappe la rue (hit the road) in a VSP.
Once seen as an anachronism that, given time, would inevitably be legislated out of existence they remain a vital means of transport for an ageing rural population.
Yes, they ought to have insurance, which is pricey if you have a record of illness or a fondness for alcohol - it can set you back as much 85 euros (£63) a month. A reputable dealership won't sell you a car unless you can show insurance, but it's not a problem if you pick one up from your mate."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-35210572

And in Sweden......as seen on Mike Brewers - Wheeler Dealers Trading Up
How young Swedes learn to drive: on 'tractors' that are cut-down cars:-
http://www.thecarconnection.com/news/11 ... -down-cars
Car for kids. Loophole in Sweden.
EPA-tractor is a Swedish phenomenon. You have to be 18 to drive a car in Sweden but a tractor you can drive on the street at 16. In the sixties youngsters started building a new kind of tractor. Keeping the build inside the rules of a farmer-meant-to-be EPA-tractor they built vehicles for use in the street at 16 years of age. The catch is that they can only go 18 mph. EPA-tractors in Sweden are homemade slow moving vessels originated from cars. After the war farmers did not have access to tractors or money but they had old Fords and Chevys in the barns. The Swedish government accepted that the farmers transformed the framed cars to tractors by leaving out some gears and making them move slowly. That loophole in the law has made it possible for youngsters to take a framed car, make it run slow and use it on the road registering it as a tractor.
http://www.worldkustom.com/en/july-2014 ... in-sweden/


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 1:49 pm 
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Location: SW London
Things don't change that much. When I upgraded at 18 from an 850 Mini to a 997 Cooper, the TPFT premium, with huge excess, was £69.15.0. That £1200 now. Road tax was £17.10.0, now £338. Petrol (super) was 6s10d a gallon, now £5.60 or £1.22 a litre.

What's changed is parking; you could park for 30 mins right outside Heathrow Terminal 1 for free....


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