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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 2:23 pm 
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So was the auction house aware that there might be an issue regarding the true identity of the car before it sold?

I wonder if the auction house has actually paid the seller or if the deal is on hold or has now fell through?

Wouldn't this be a classified as a reconstructed classic by the DVLA? or even require an IVA as it's some new parts have been fitted?

Shame, it was a nice looking car.


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 2:26 pm 
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Location: Oop North where it's dark & cold nearly all the time.
So was the auction house aware that there might be an issue regarding the true identity of the car before it sold?

I know for certain that at least one person (not me) raised a question regarding this car, but were given the brush off.

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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 3:01 pm 
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They do have a bit of previous for this sort of thing:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -sale.html


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 3:12 pm 
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To be fair to Bonhams or any other auction house they can't pull a lot from an auction unless somebody puts some proof on the table that the decription is misleading and that was absent at the time of the auction. I did notice the auctioneer was very conservative in his description of it on the day. They can only regard an unsubstantiated complaint as 'heresay' and that's what they did. I know that intervention has taken place (by the '59 Register) on a couple of other occasions when Minis have gone to auction.


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 4:21 pm 
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So if the 'legal' owner of 777 still has the paperwork could he not dispute the legality of 850 as the car is a clone of 777 (numbers wise) and he has the proof, that would be a bit of a shocker for the new owner if the DVLA pulled the identity of the car and put it on a Q plate (or worse)

Oh am I glad I'm not in a position to buy another Mini :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 4:40 pm 
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mk1coopers wrote:
So if the 'legal' owner of 777 still has the paperwork could he not dispute the legality of 850 as the car is a clone of 777 (numbers wise) and he has the proof, that would be a bit of a shocker for the new owner if the DVLA pulled the identity of the car and put it on a Q plate (or worse)

Oh am I glad I'm not in a position to buy another Mini :lol:


His original paperwork got nicked by the mystery "Mini Expert", he now just has copies is my understanding. I doubt he can be arsed might be the truth of the matter, he won't get much reward for the agro. I've been in the same boat stood next to an owner and his car at a show once but didn't have the gall to ruin his day!!


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 6:29 pm 
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I thought it was common practice in car auctions that part of the buyers premium includes an indemnity fee?
If the car turns out to be stolen or a right off you are covered..... Even my local two bit car auction selling low value stuff does this.
You would hope that given what the auction house charge both the seller and the buyer that some level of cover would be included?


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 7:14 pm 
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Pete wrote:
mk1coopers wrote:
So if the 'legal' owner of 777 still has the paperwork could he not dispute the legality of 850 as the car is a clone of 777 (numbers wise) and he has the proof, that would be a bit of a shocker for the new owner if the DVLA pulled the identity of the car and put it on a Q plate (or worse)

Oh am I glad I'm not in a position to buy another Mini :lol:


His original paperwork got nicked by the mystery "Mini Expert", he now just has copies is my understanding. I doubt he can be arsed might be the truth of the matter, he won't get much reward for the agro. I've been in the same boat stood next to an owner and his car at a show once but didn't have the gall to ruin his day!!


Ah the mysterious paperwork fire, perhaps that's where the rumour that the car had gone up in flames came from, it was a lot of money for a collection of parts, some real, some fantasy :roll:


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 10:37 pm 
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mk1coopers wrote:
Ah the mysterious paperwork fire


I've been promised a copy of '777MCG's logbook from someone, which ties in 100% with the details of the 850 MCG lemon. Another total bullshit story attached to a "period racer" has just popped up on Car and Classic. Like buses, they all come along at once!


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:52 am 
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Location: Beyond the Sun
Talking of "mysterious paperwork fires"...we have had one of those too in the Laverda Jota motorcycle family. No one knows what a real factory Jota is or what, so now the only ones that fetch full whack are the ones orginating from the Slater Bros dealership in Herefordshire in the late 70s/early 80s. Fortunately Mr Slater is still alive and well and can sell you a letter of authenticity if you own one that came from his workshop. Unfortunately for the guys that think they have a factory Laverda originating from the Italian factory (obviously not a Slater Jota), every time one appears on eBay, it is subjected to endless abuse and scrutiny on the forums. As the saying goes...if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck and walks like a duck...it's a duck...but not if the boot shelf brackets have more than 6 spotwelds*

*I made that bit up - I wouldn't know how many spotwelds they should have.

And also....
As people that know me will know, I know bugger all about the subject of original cars as my interest is historic racing BUT...I do know about rich people. The bloke that bought this car is probably so rich, he doesn't even know he's bought it.
In normal life you get people like us who re-mortgage the house to pay for school fees and take a holiday when the annual bonus comes up trumps - we are known as middle class comfortable or whatever bracket some marketer like to put us into.
Every now and then I meet people so rich they simply have no idea of the value of anything...pint of milk...new Mercedes...new house...Jaguar D-type. A man like this bought this car and if it's only worth £28,000 and not £63,000, it means diddly squat. It's only back pocket cash anyway.
After a race once at Donington, I invited this lovely chap and his wife back to the camper for a glass of wine and a chat as the sun set on a beautiful evening. He said, "I'd love to, but the chopper's picking us up in a minute to take us to the airport...we're racing the new powerboat in Marseille tomorrow". It didn't even register with him, how out of kilter the rest of us were. Although I suspect his wife knew full well where she'd rather be :oops:


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