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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 12:28 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 8:01 pm
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Location: Dunfermline, Fife
I suspect that they are hoping that someone in to look at a much dearer Aston will see the mini and think (or perhaps a partner will think) 'That's cute' and the asking price leaves plenty of wriggle room to make it appear even more of a 'bargain' - especially if it can be lost in the mix between a 2 car deal.

It presents them (the dealer) as more 'accessible', whilst proving they are anything but.......

That said, a lot of top end collectors have a love of minis, and as we all know, if you are happy to believe the story, that is an absolutely cracking car. Many top end collectors are happy to believe the history of other cars, so why not this one too? 8-) :lol:

Al


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 1:32 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2017 11:26 pm
Posts: 39
Either its had very little use or its miraculous that its only had one rebore, a more normal scenario would be three brush heads and five shafts but still an original brush. No records to check you just have to rely on what one chap said to another and passed it on. Hey ho..you pays your 90K and smile. Mind you you would think that unlike Astons. cooper s were essentially a competition modified car and that should tell you something?? Original is that a word you can use with the S all the ones in the 60s & 70s I remember weren't!!


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:22 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 11:30 am
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Location: In the Village.
Couldn't agree more Vintage to Classic.

There is more smoke & mirrors in the classic car market than anything else. Just reading through the legal case involving JD Classics you can see how "fluid" prices actually are.

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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 3:05 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 25, 2010 3:30 pm
Posts: 509
i believe old motor bikes are also a very murky world to deal in, by old i mean pretty old 1920 - 1940 era, heard the odd very tall tale regarding them

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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:54 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2015 5:25 pm
Posts: 1129
Honest Assessment :)

My experience with the Mini is post these companies so many hold precious.

When I built engines in the seventies for serious competition none of these companies were rated and were outdated.

The engine builders I rated back then was Gordon Allen, Paul Ivey and Richard Longman.

Alan


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 5:05 pm 
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Location: In the Village.
The engine builders I rated back then was Gordon Allen, Paul Ivey and Richard Longman.

Coincidentally every one of which graduated from the Downton school of engine tuning :lol:

Gordon Allen was the first person to work on an A Series engine when Downton was still at the old Headlands works. By all accounts Bunty made him vacate what was euphemistically called the workshop & made him finish the build under a tree in the yard. She didn't want people seeing them working on such mundane little engines!

If only she knew what was coming only a year or so later!!

In actual fact I don't agree with the comments above. I reckon that the Top end work carried out by the likes of Downton, Arden, Broadspeed, BVRT, Speedwell etc. Was as good as anything done even today. Where the difference lays is the boggo standard customer road car tuning & accessories which were a lot worse back then.

The sort of power people were getting in the late 60's has not really been improved on. It's the suspension & tyre choices that have made the cars faster. John Rhodes could rarely smoke a set of tyres by the time he retired, it wasn't him that was any slower, it was the tyres that actually stuck!

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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 5:41 pm 
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Mark,

Sorry to disagree, I've an inclined valve head (Paul Ivey) and a genuine Downton race head both here. I used the Paul Ivey cylinder in action, the Downton is on a road car where it belongs :)

Alan


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 8:00 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 25, 2010 5:37 pm
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Location: N/E England Where the SAND is GOLDEN and the sea is always COLD!!
Reading the Aston workshop’s own description Quote: "Upon arrival here at Aston Workshop, this Mini has been meticulously scrutinised and (where necessary) re-built to the same exacting standards as our award winning Aston Martins to ensure we can offer this exceptional piece of motoring history in pristine condition.” I am certain that a lot of the people on this forum would agree, that a well restored car be it an Aston or a mini for 90K or even 50K it is the little things and detail that should be correct.

Unlike a lot of people on this forum I don't know a lot of the finer detail’s on these cars but looking at the pictures on their website as detailed as the build has been, I think that there is a lot of the finer detail that appears to be wrong for a car that has been rebuilt to the their exacting standard. Just like JD classics they are making reference to the the investment opportunities,and looking for someone with more money than sense. :shock:

http://www.aston.co.uk/cars-for-sale/mi ... -s/car1485


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 9:06 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:10 pm
Posts: 103
First thing I would have done is get it sitting a little better, not a fan of that nose up stance!


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 Post subject: Re: "Downton" Cooper S??
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 9:19 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2017 11:26 pm
Posts: 39
I would like to think any s today would have the same performance it had of yore but I do think people underestimate how much modern machine tools have revolutionized parts manufacture and also materials that are now commonly available. I am not just talking CNC but the fact that even a manual mill and lathe has repeatable accuracy as a result of digital readouts that Downton could only dream of. Considering what they had I would say the performance of 60s tuning with what they had was staggering. Today you can machine bespoke pistons rods cranks mill altered valve angles and thats before people start cheating!! I do agree tyres are a tremendous performance upgrade, Minispares will sell you a beautiful set of rose-jointed lower arms that any 60s racer would have flipped for, poor smoking John made do with a set of negative cambers, the rest of us a hacksaw and a welder. There is an interesting point would you buy an S if it was was on welded bottom arms even if that was how it was in period?
Talking of smoking John only racer I have ever see that got an ovation at Druids on his warm up lap: magic.


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